jogging and motivation thread

WussRedXLi

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Wah......this guy (Stu) also likes the Feidian series. Challenger 4 and 5.

He got the 5 off taobao, seems like no issue in Aus nowdays. Direct Air ship available. But private seller, that's why cheaper than official.


 
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Kuudere

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Actually gonna use 2XU to run 4.15-4.16 pace and see how long I can last haha.

Training have not been going smooth since my injury. But I am still hopeful
Depends on your goals, I wouldn’t go all out if injured unless you don’t have many upcoming races lined up. Or you really have no choice but to race competitively for income (pro runner). Otherwise, much rather take things easy, if not injury doesn’t recover and keep relapsing.
The book has a paragraph or two on tune up races and explain the rational of tune up races. You can decide what to do after reading it.
Screenshot-2026-03-05-080431.png


Did my lactate threshold run yesterday, will be aiming for 4.05 min/km 8km tune up and 4.08 min/km 10k tune up race. Seems like a realistic goal later on.
Is this a hack



just lean forward? No extra effort to get more performance huh?

A slight forward lean is the right way to run. But as people run longer, their running form dips over time. It’s important to condition yourself to stick to the forward lean running form as you get more tired. I have this issue as I run further, but I just remind myself no matter how tired I am, I need to adjust my form to forward lean. Takes a lot of runs to get used to it.
 

WussRedXLi

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Interesting new nuance on fuelling.

The crossover point from using predominantly glycogen to fat stores with intakes of 60, 90 and 120g/h.
She felt the best with 120g/h. This is Holly Archer, ex decathelete, present (EU, national) elite grade runner and Hyroxer, iirc 32 min 10k and first FM last year 2:39.

In the past, they did test with 1 x GCN guy presenter (Connor) and 1 x GTN lady presenter and Connor was an ex-pro actually and still in good fitness currently, and found the usage rate was around 45g/h. This is the actual oxidation/usage rate (not intake, not GI tolerance)


For me i think i shall just stick to bananas or similar (slightly more complex carbs vs HFCS or honey which is still glucose fructose mix at similar enough ratios) and then kang shi bo honey green tea which is super easy to intake esp on the bike it's literally second nature, seems no issue at fast paces. Cheap and good and still easy to eat.
Think every weekend 2 x full meals of porridge, prata, fishball noodles, indo bakmi etc super trained liao > 100 times liao in the past 1 year plus. :crazy:
(sometimes even mutton curry or malay green chilli chicken rice but that's towards the end part).......though of coz that's at lower intensities.


At 120g per hour, I experienced:
✔ Lower perceived effort (RPE)
✔ Better perceived energy levels
✔ Improved fluid retention
✔ Less body mass loss
✔ A delayed shift toward fat oxidation

This matters because carbohydrate produces more energy per litre of oxygen than fat, making it the more efficient fuel at marathon pace. When fuelling at 60g per hour, I lost 1.4kg of body mass, likely mostly fluid, and showed an earlier shift toward fat use, meaning less efficient energy production for the same effort. This is why fuelling shouldn’t be guesswork.

ps. Some might note that is for Holly, an elite fast athelete. The researchers noted that it's the same or even more important that average athletes fuel the same, coz they are out there on the course for even longer, so delaying that carb -> fax oxidation switch point till a latter stage is even more advantageous.

 
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WussRedXLi

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A slight forward lean is the right way to run. But as people run longer, their running form dips over time. It’s important to condition yourself to stick to the forward lean running form as you get more tired. I have this issue as I run further, but I just remind myself no matter how tired I am, I need to adjust my form to forward lean. Takes a lot of runs to get used to it.
Is this a hack



just lean forward? No extra effort to get more performance huh?

Put it this way, the ground contact times and "braking forces" and biomechanics, vertical bounce blah etc aide .......if cadence is exactly the same, then the difference between 4:15 and 6:00 is that the stride length is different. Stride length is the "end product" of all those factors, no ways around that, it's just basic physics.
Also, though it does not seem obvious from the A-B video, the heel lift and knee lift for 4:15 is a bit higher than 6:00.....this one you cannot help one with faster paces (so do your strengthening for hammies and TFL/illiopsoas etc lol...which can also have better economy effects).


Also gonna be different power (watt, kJ)....which of coz affects your body's energy system(s) production, which affects HR...... But there is no way, i think even for elite athletes, to be doing 4:15 and 6:00 at the same HR.
Ultimately HR is a very good indicator of how much energy (effort) you are using.


Of coz, even for the same person, there will be differing running economy at difference paces with such tweaks in running form, but they are in the single digit percentages (doesnt cross beyong 10%)........ also depends on how much you strength trained and any other things you have done like plyo in which different paces also possibly would have different RE based on differing assistance from the SSC mainly due to your achilles tendon and aided by simi muscle/tendon as a whole unit and neuro factors.

I dont think that "braking force" mechanism would also be that much different.

I also can stick to say 180 cadence (listen to dnb music lah) and do 4:15 and 6:00 pace, you can too if you try it.

Expanding on 1 point above.
AI :
Yes, different running paces can have different running economy (RE) responses to plyometric training, primarily because faster running speeds rely more heavily on the stretch-shortening cycle (SSC), which plyometric training specifically improves. Plyometrics increase muscle-tendon stiffness and neuromuscular power, leading to better energy storage and return at high speeds, which improves the efficiency of high-speed running more significantly than slow-paced running.
PubMed Central (PMC) (.gov) +3
 

WussRedXLi

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Is this a hack



just lean forward? No extra effort to get more performance huh?


Ultimately, dont get too worried about all the minor details, you can see from the above, it's really too much, it's not something that one can pick everything up in just 3-6 months . And if you try to put your mind to learn and force it coz of points A - Z listed, the more you cannot learn or just take longer to learn.....unless if you are really talented and have a gift for running and hence can "absorb" every points listed from A-Z.


Just do your strides, with a bit of short 40-60m sprints (if pro and strong and fast liao then extend to 75m). Hill sprints might lower injuries from sprinting to be lower too.
These do reinforce neuromuscular good form, or put it this way when you just jog you are just much more likely to learn bad form.

Also dont forget, you and others might have some wierd funny biomechanical quirks....we all have, just a matter of how much and how many only. Your body has a good ability to sort itself out tho , same thing with cycling.......so just do strides, do your strengthening to aid and that'd be about it. Your foot strikes etc all will more or less naturally sort itself out as it'll try to find the most comfortable and efficient way to run but it will take time. You'd also really need to aid that process with strengthening esp with faster running, cant stress that enough, even though it's unpopular with a fair number of runners....go google what are the standards needed for various muscles.


Able to properly lean forward and maintain for a good distance also depends heavily on you core strength, which acts as the stabilizer between your legs as the "force producer" and the upper parts being propelled forward. Might not seem intuitive but this becomes more and more important when you try to run fast and longer, also indirectly aiding overall RE etc.
Probably also why some folks cannot / find it difficult to run fast when they are sloppy, weak.
This also plays out in a similar manner in cycling. maybe to a much smaller degree ba.......but it's also foundational.


All these things do add up ultimately, quite foundational

ps. Try to run 2-3k first (if you have been doing long distances of 8-15k at slow 8-10 min paces and not solely/only being health focussed, really best to regress it down), or even fast intervals, build it up. When one is not strong enough (strength training) tries to gun so far, the fatigue just Fs things up and you'd never learn.
Strides reinforces and build good form via neuromuscular, and then good neuromuscular muscle memory from then on.......also difficult to kena very bad form liao. If you are still a NSmen as in young enough, there is really no reason why cannot run fast, even if BMI is high.
Wont take very long also, after which you can do longer distances and slower paces of your choosing to build up aerobic base.

But of coz this is if you are interested in running form and stuff, if you are just after aerobic base and duration rather than speed/efficiency, then probably anything is fine as long as you are not injured.
 
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Tudo88

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Depends on your goals, I wouldn’t go all out if injured unless you don’t have many upcoming races lined up. Or you really have no choice but to race competitively for income (pro runner). Otherwise, much rather take things easy, if not injury doesn’t recover and keep relapsing.

Screenshot-2026-03-05-080431.png


Did my lactate threshold run yesterday, will be aiming for 4.05 min/km 8km tune up and 4.08 min/km 10k tune up race. Seems like a realistic goal later on.

A slight forward lean is the right way to run. But as people run longer, their running form dips over time. It’s important to condition yourself to stick to the forward lean running form as you get more tired. I have this issue as I run further, but I just remind myself no matter how tired I am, I need to adjust my form to forward lean. Takes a lot of runs to get used to it.
Actually my end goal not just sub 90 haha. Looking to hit sub 88 this year. Must dare to dream in order to hit it.
 

sph777

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Actually my end goal not just sub 90 haha. Looking to hit sub 88 this year. Must dare to dream in order to hit it.
Actually for me just realised that whenever I have goals leading up to races, I end up cramping or not achieving anything. My sub 20 5km, pbs for half and 10km last year was when I went into the races thinking I will just do my best without having a goal in mind.
 

Ender

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Actually for me just realised that whenever I have goals leading up to races, I end up cramping or not achieving anything. My sub 20 5km, pbs for half and 10km last year was when I went into the races thinking I will just do my best without having a goal in mind.
Strangely, my 5km PB was an unexpected too, it was 21:39 during the covid opening up period. Basically for almost two years, I did no high intensity training and did a 100% very strict MAF training where I kept my HR below 128bpm. Zero high intensity workout. It was also these two years I built the most mileage/year in my lifetime due to this very low intensity runs and the covid shut down that gave me too much time plus no goals to aim for coz no race. When the stadium finally opened up for public, I decided to check how much of my lactate threshold have degraded. I surprised myself, coz prior to MAF, I just barely reach 22:30.
 

sph777

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Strangely, my 5km PB was an unexpected too, it was 21:39 during the covid opening up period. Basically for almost two years, I did no high intensity training and did a 100% very strict MAF training where I kept my HR below 128bpm. Zero high intensity workout. It was also these two years I built the most mileage/year in my lifetime due to this very low intensity runs and the covid shut down that gave me too much time plus no goals to aim for coz no race. When the stadium finally opened up for public, I decided to check how much of my lactate threshold have degraded. I surprised myself, coz prior to MAF, I just barely reach 22:30.
Maybe the body does better with less pressure/ stress?
 

GlassDoor

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Decathon's new range of Kiprun shoes worth checking out.
Tried their new range in store yesterday.. reallly like kiprun kipride max's feel, cushioned and smooth ride. But did not buy on the spot cos the padding is abit excessive. confirm sweat sponge and pond on longer runs for me.
But for new runners doing 30-40mins daily runs.. worth checking out.
 

Tudo88

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Maybe the body does better with less pressure/ stress?
But do you feel pressured or stressed when you want to hit your goal timing?

I only get excited haha. But anyway your training will dictate the results. Got to train at your goal pace and see how your body feels. For me, I know sub 90 is way off now since my HR is spiking whenever I run at 4.15 so I know that’s not sustainable for HM for now.
 

sph777

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But do you feel pressured or stressed when you want to hit your goal timing?

I only get excited haha. But anyway your training will dictate the results. Got to train at your goal pace and see how your body feels. For me, I know sub 90 is way off now since my HR is spiking whenever I run at 4.15 so I know that’s not sustainable for HM for now.
I think marathon especially. At start line starting the run, hr alr 166. Was unsustainable. Probably cause of dnf previous marathons and thinking whether can maintain goal pace.
 

Tudo88

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I think marathon especially. At start line starting the run, hr alr 166. Was unsustainable. Probably cause of dnf previous marathons and thinking whether can maintain goal pace.
Yeah 166 too high at start already haha. You saw chio bu is it? Why your HR spike so high? Haha

You can try negative split next time I guess. More sustainable
 

WussRedXLi

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edit - of coz, dont take it that this can take away aerobic base or slower runs....esp if you are after any appreciable distance even for 3k straddling middle to long distance. That is not the aim.
Actually, to be able to run with good form, it is sort of a skill that needs learning and practising and with some other pre-requisites like sufficient strength in some parts of the body. It is not the same as brisk walking, in which literally anyone can do. The good news is that the skills level needed is not as high as in other sports like swimming or calisthenics.

AI Overview


Running fast, such as through sprints or high-intensity strides, improves running form by
forcing the central nervous system (CNS) to coordinate muscles with higher speed, precision, and efficiency. This neuromuscular training "rewires" the brain-body communication, optimizing motor unit recruitment and improving running economy, which allows for better form at all speeds.
Runners Connect +2
Here is why running fast teaches better neuromuscular, or "neuro," form:

1. Improved Motor Unit Recruitment and Firing Rate
  • Activating Fast-Twitch Fibers: Fast running forces the recruitment of Type II (fast-twitch) muscle fibers, which are rarely utilized during slow, easy jogs.
  • Faster Signal Transmission: High-speed running improves the ability of the CNS to rapidly send signals to muscles, allowing for quicker reaction times and faster muscle activation.
  • Increased Motor Unit Synchronization: The brain learns to fire multiple motor units simultaneously rather than asynchronously, producing more force with less effort.
    outperformsports.com
    outperformsports.com +5

2. Enhanced Inter-muscular Coordination (Efficient Movement)
  • Reduced "Antagonist" Resistance: Efficient runners master the art of relaxing opposing muscles (antagonists) while activating primary muscles (agonists). Fast running trains your muscles to stop fighting against each other, reducing wasted energy.
  • Better Muscle Sequencing: Speed training optimizes the timing of muscle contractions at the neuromuscular junction, improving the "program" your brain uses to coordinate movement.
    Runners Connect +4

3. Structural and Mechanical Adjustments
  • Increased Tendon Stiffness: Fast running increases the elasticity of tendons, allowing them to act as springs, storing and returning energy, which reduces ground contact time and improves efficiency.
  • Improved Ground Contact: Fast running forces you to land closer to your center of mass and with a higher cadence, reducing overstriding and unnecessary vertical oscillation.
  • Posture Correction: To maintain stability at high speeds, the body naturally adopts a better, more upright posture, which then translates to better form at slower speeds.
    RunRepeat +4

4. Neural Adaptations and Fatigue Resistance
  • Improved Economy: Because your nervous system becomes more efficient at producing force, you use less oxygen to maintain a certain speed (better running economy).
  • Fatigue Management: Fast running trains the body to handle higher amounts of lactate, allowing you to maintain good form even when tired, as the neuromuscular system is better at dealing with "lazier" muscles.
    owayo +2
Key Takeaway: Running fast teaches your body that efficient form is necessary for survival at high speed. This, in turn, upgrades your "software" (neuromuscular coordination), making your body a more efficient, better-coordinated machine at any speed.
Runners Connect +2
 
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WussRedXLi

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Just sharing for the uncles here :

Really, the feeling of getting your "first" pull up, again, is really great. NSF that time is one thing (no real big difficulty unless if obese or one does zero training attempts then yeah it does not come magically), but doing it again when you are over 50 is priceless.
And in the local context, not many can do it as the entry bar for both strength and skills for a proper one is not low (even though in calisthenics it is literally newbie level), even for those who are recreationally fit.
I can tell you, at the fitness corner, when you hair is greying and hairline receding, you still do dips/pull up (or even weighted or explosively with slow eccentrics), really is aura farming.
Heck - even the overhead press log lift, if you do it explosively single-handed and can throw the heaviest log up for 6 inches, is already somewhat aura farming.

If not pulling, can also try pushing. ie Dips



 
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