CPF Account Value Thread 2025

[henrylbh]

Nah, house fully paid in CPF, FRS and MA already max. Trying my best to minimize fund in RA and CPF lfe after 55

FRS in RA at age 55 is fixed. Nothing can be done except to pledge your property and take out amount above BRS as soon as possible. But do you need the money or can you earn at least 4% yearly on the amount withdrawn?

My fren withdrew all his OA/SA when he reached 55 with FRS. Then ended up with problems searching for FI to place money in FD paying pittance and he took many years to put back OA what you withdraw.

 

[kelhot2001]

FRS in RA at age 55 is fixed. Nothing can be done except to pledge your property and take out amount above BRS as soon as possible. But do you need the money or can you earn at least 4% yearly on the amount withdrawn?

My fren withdrew all his OA/SA when he reached 55 with FRS. Then ended up with problems searching for FI to place money in FD paying pittance and he took many years to put back OA what you withdraw.

I presumed that the BRS monies cannot be transfer back to OA. Unless after pledging the house, I opt under BRS and use that cash to pay back HDB and transfer that monies back to OA. Tio bo?

 

[royalmix]

I presumed that the BRS monies cannot be transfer back to OA. Unless after pledging the house, I opt under BRS and use that cash to pay back HDB and transfer that monies back to OA. Tio bo?

(Hint) there were so much discusssions donkey years ago, go reread the hacks there!

 

[kelhot2001]

(Hint) there were so much discusssions donkey years ago, go reread the hacks there!

I read alot back then, but then there is SA and now no more

 

[BBCWatcher]

I presumed that the BRS monies cannot be transfer back to OA. Unless after pledging the house, I opt under BRS and use that cash to pay back HDB and transfer that monies back to OA. Tio bo?

Yes, you could (to some extent) withdraw funds from a 4.0% interest earning account to pay off a 2.6% (or lower?) mortgage faster than required and/or to deposit those funds in a 2.5% interest earning account. Most people would consider that trade quite strange, but you're allowed to do it. Other CPF members and even the general taxpaying public should thank you for volunteering to accept lower interest from the government.

 

[kelhot2001]

Yes, you could (to some extent) withdraw funds from a 4.0% interest earning account to pay off a 2.6% (or lower?) mortgage faster than required and/or to deposit those funds in a 2.5% interest earning account. Most people would consider that trade quite strange, but you're allowed to do it. Other CPF members and even the general taxpaying public should thank you for volunteering to accept lower interest from the government.

Yes true, at the same time, it could be said that those 30% alive pass 90 years of age , will thank those 70% who pass on before 85 , for the 4% interest contribution to support them.

 

[BBCWatcher]

Yes true, at the same time, it could be said that those 30% alive pass 90 years of age , will thank those 70% who pass on before 85 , for the 4% interest contribution to support them.

Sure, the folks who end up experiencing longevity (and thus higher longevity risk) are pleased when they've adequately insured against that risk. But the government is still supporting the whole program with 4+% interest on every dollar in the program. If you want to downgrade the interest part to 2.5% (or effectively 2.6% if you pay off a HDB loan faster than required), you can, but that's a very large rate penalty to avoid what's an actuarially fair payout stream.

Moreover, you can't actually safely spend anywhere near as much from dollars in a quasi savings account earning 2.5% as you can spend from a life annuity stream. A Safe Withdrawal Rate (SWR) on OA is likely below 3%, whereas the life annuity stream will be more than double that. So you've got to downgrade your retirement lifestyle and/or be less generous in your gifts with the rate downgrade you're proposing.

 

[royalmix]

Ask Chatgpt:

Flaw in Retirement Planning: Silo Thinking & Over-Reliance on CPF LIFE​

Many people approach retirement planning with silo thinking — treating CPF LIFE as their only or main source of income, rather than seeing it as just one part of a broader retirement income strategy.

The Problem:​

• CPF LIFE payouts are limited and may not fully cover your desired lifestyle, especially with rising costs and longer life expectancy.
• By focusing only on CPF LIFE, people ignore other potential income streams that can significantly boost financial security and flexibility in retirement.

Why This Happens:​

• Lack of financial literacy or planning skills.
• A mindset of “play it safe” — trusting only government schemes.
• Tools and advice that present income sources in isolation.
• Fear or unfamiliarity with investing and income diversification.

The Better Approach:​

Adopt a total wealth perspective — think in terms of multiple income sources working together:

• CPF LIFE (guaranteed base)
• Investments (dividends, REITs, SRS)
• Property rental income
• Side income (consulting, part-time work)
• Insurance payouts or annuities

---

Bottom Line:​

Don’t put your retirement in a CPF LIFE silo.
Build a diversified income strategy to support the lifestyle you want — with stability, flexibility, and resilience.

 

[BBCWatcher]

Ask Chatgpt:

Ask what? What question did you pose?

Many people approach retirement planning with silo thinking — treating CPF LIFE as their only or main source of income, rather than seeing it as just one part of a broader retirement income strategy.

“Many people”? How many? Who?

I literally don’t know anyone who’s ever argued that CPF LIFE ought to be your sole or main source of income in retirement. It’s very possible someone could end up with CPF LIFE as their sole or main source of income in retirement, in which case thank goodness for CPF LIFE. But as a desirable financial goal, no, nobody is arguing that — among other reasons because it’s desirable to have accumulated much more wealth than the Enhanced Retirement Sum by age 55. So why is ChatGPT spewing a strawman out of the gate? (Perhaps because you posed a question based on that strawman, but nobody knows since you didn’t post the question you asked.)

 

[kelhot2001]

Sure, the folks who end up experiencing longevity (and thus higher longevity risk) are pleased when they've adequately insured against that risk. But the government is still supporting the whole program with 4+% interest on every dollar in the program. If you want to downgrade the interest part to 2.5% (or effectively 2.6% if you pay off a HDB loan faster than required), you can, but that's a very large rate penalty to avoid what's an actuarially fair payout stream.

Moreover, you can't actually safely spend anywhere near as much from dollars in a quasi savings account earning 2.5% as you can spend from a life annuity stream. A Safe Withdrawal Rate (SWR) on OA is likely below 3%, whereas the life annuity stream will be more than double that. So you've got to downgrade your retirement lifestyle and/or be less generous in your gifts with the rate downgrade you're proposing.

End of the day, still only abt 30% get to enjoy the 4% fruit of the other 70% who passed on. I would like to think the others 70% did not get what they deserved. In additional to that of the 30% who still alive, 33% are probably male while the rest are female. So as a male the chance of hitting 90 is abt 12 out of the 100 alive. Hahahaha.

What the govt is providing is the way it used to provide RSS and now CPF life are still using the same methodology to provide the same 4%. But no additional funds required to pool CPFlife, so where did thiz funds come from? It come from the 4% interest of the CPF life of the decease, which in the old system is the bequest from the deceased.

Always 2 side of the coins, I already have enough of your retirement fund. Housing already fully paid up in my 50s, FRS/MA already achieved, other source of income and own retirement in OA and also personal funds. So IMHO, CPFlife isnt great for me, it is just a bad bet.


CPF life isnt bad, the interest is good, just that minority get to benefit from it and not the majority. Just pray hard to be the minority. Cheers

 

[BBCWatcher]

End of the day, still only abt 30% get to enjoy the 4% fruit of the other 70% who passed on. I would like to think the others 70% did not get what they deserved.

Are you questioning whether anybody should ever buy insurance?

I don't think longevity insurance is hard to understand, but evidently some people don't understand it. So I'll try. Fundamentally, longevity insurance gives you greater freedom in retirement to spend (i.e. to support a particular real lifestyle) and/or (if you wish) to give. Self-insuring against all longevity risk is very expensive. The "70%" (I'm taking your claim at face value for sake of argument) also benefit because they can safely enjoy a nicer real lifestyle (and/or give away more money) without fear of exhausting their savings.

Simply compare a reasonable Safe Withdrawal Rate (SWR) from one's one assets against the percentage that CPF LIFE pays out of a particular input value. There's just no comparison. The latter percentage is hugely bigger than the former. You need a MUCH bigger amount of wealth to safely generate the same amount of retirement income on your own. Doesn't practically every retiree benefit from that stark difference in lifetime spending/giving power? There are also asset protection benefits inherent in CPF LIFE. Many seniors burn through savings due to addictions or dementia, or they become fraud victims. CPF LIFE income is effectively immune to such calamities.

Why do you buy home insurance when only a tiny minority of policyholders even make a claim?

In additional to that of the 30% who still alive, 33% are probably male while the rest are female. So as a male the chance of hitting 90 is abt 12 out of the 100 alive. Hahahaha.

That's entirely moot. Males and females are in completely separate CPF LIFE risk pools. Males only pool longevity risk with males; females only with females. Maybe CPF LIFE shouldn't be designed that way, but that's how it is. Consequently CPF LIFE payouts for males are slightly higher than they are for females.

 

[DevilPlate]

End of the day, still only abt 30% get to enjoy the 4% fruit of the other 70% who passed on. I would like to think the others 70% did not get what they deserved. In additional to that of the 30% who still alive, 33% are probably male while the rest are female. So as a male the chance of hitting 90 is abt 12 out of the 100 alive. Hahahaha.

What the govt is providing is the way it used to provide RSS and now CPF life are still using the same methodology to provide the same 4%. But no additional funds required to pool CPFlife, so where did thiz funds come from? It come from the 4% interest of the CPF life of the decease, which in the old system is the bequest from the deceased.

Always 2 side of the coins, I already have enough of your retirement fund. Housing already fully paid up in my 50s, FRS/MA already achieved, other source of income and own retirement in OA and also personal funds. So IMHO, CPFlife isnt great for me, it is just a bad bet.


CPF life isnt bad, the interest is good, just that minority get to benefit from it and not the majority. Just pray hard to be the minority. Cheers

Stop valuing CPFLife as an investment and u will be enlightened
As i said before, there are notable intangible benefits like paying for safety net/peace of mind in return of spending more freely during retirement.

How about insurance in general like Term Life or even Medishield? It all works the same. Why Warren Buffet holds so much insurance companies?

Many try to value insurance as an investment and so ended up falling into traps like buying Whole Life (instead of Term) and ILPs/long term endowment etc.

 

[kelhot2001]

Stop valuing CPFLife as an investment and u will be enlightened
As i said before, there are notable intangible benefits like paying for safety net/peace of mind in return of spending more freely during retirement.

How about insurance in general like Term Life or even Medishield? It all works the same. Why Warren Buffet holds so much insurance companies?

Many try to value insurance as an investment and so ended up falling into traps like buying Whole Life (instead of Term) and ILPs/long term endowment etc.

Stop see CPFlife as annuity,CPF started off as a retirement funds. Once you see it , you will be enlightened too.

 

[DevilPlate]

Stop see CPFlife as annuity,CPF started off as a retirement funds. Once you see it , you will be enlightened too.

Its is an annuity no matter how u look at it.

At least for now they have given people a choice between BRS to 4XFRS to suits one’s needs and beliefs

 

[kelhot2001]

Its is an annuity no matter how u look at it.

At least for now they have given people a choice between BRS to 4XFRS to suits one’s needs and beliefs

Like I said before 2009, it wasnt

 

[DevilPlate]

Like I said before 2009, it wasnt

There are also extremists that decide to uproot and get 100% CPF back

 

[royalmix]

Ask Chatgpt:

CPF LIFE Is a Tool, Not a One-Size-Fits-All Solution


CPF LIFE is mandatory, yes — but how you use it should depend on your overall retirement strategy.


Some key principles to consider:

---

1. CPF LIFE is insurance, not an investment.
It protects against longevity risk — the chance you live much longer than expected and run out of money. Like other insurance, its value is in certainty, not return.


Don’t judge it purely by "interest rate" or IRR. That’s missing the point.

---

2. Pick the CPF LIFE plan that fits your needs.
Some may benefit from the Standard Plan for higher payouts. Others might prefer the Basic Plan — lower payouts, but more flexibility and a higher bequest.


If someone has other income streams or expects shorter-than-average longevity, locking up more in CPF LIFE might not be ideal.

---

3. CPF LIFE should be the foundation, not the whole plan.
A balanced retirement strategy includes:

• Investments (SRS, dividends, REITs)
• Insurance (e.g. Whole Life policies with surrender value)
• Cash and emergency funds
• Property or other passive income
• Even part-time or flexible work if desired

CPF LIFE should cover essentials. The rest gives flexibility and freedom.

---

4. There’s no "best" plan — only what fits your situation.
Everyone’s health, family history, risk appetite, and financial goals differ. What’s optimal for one person could be suboptimal for another.


The key is to build around your own needs, not just follow general advice or chase theoretical returns.

---

Bottom line:
CPF LIFE is just one piece of the puzzle. Use it wisely — but don't treat it like the whole retirement plan.

 

[DevilPlate]

Ask Chatgpt:

CPF LIFE Is a Tool, Not a One-Size-Fits-All Solution


CPF LIFE is mandatory, yes — but how you use it should depend on your overall retirement strategy.


Some key principles to consider:

---

1. CPF LIFE is insurance, not an investment.
It protects against longevity risk — the chance you live much longer than expected and run out of money. Like other insurance, its value is in certainty, not return.


Don’t judge it purely by "interest rate" or IRR. That’s missing the point.

---

2. Pick the CPF LIFE plan that fits your needs.
Some may benefit from the Standard Plan for higher payouts. Others might prefer the Basic Plan — lower payouts, but more flexibility and a higher bequest.


If someone has other income streams or expects shorter-than-average longevity, locking up more in CPF LIFE might not be ideal.

---

3. CPF LIFE should be the foundation, not the whole plan.
A balanced retirement strategy includes:

• Investments (SRS, dividends, REITs)
• Insurance (e.g. Whole Life policies with surrender value)
• Cash and emergency funds
• Property or other passive income
• Even part-time or flexible work if desired

CPF LIFE should cover essentials. The rest gives flexibility and freedom.

---

4. There’s no "best" plan — only what fits your situation.
Everyone’s health, family history, risk appetite, and financial goals differ. What’s optimal for one person could be suboptimal for another.


The key is to build around your own needs, not just follow general advice or chase theoretical returns.

---

Bottom line:
CPF LIFE is just one piece of the puzzle. Use it wisely — but don't treat it like the whole retirement plan.

Maybe part of the answer come from combing website like HWZ MM!

 

[limster]

I will only spend my dividend/passive income during retirement and not touch the principal. So I am not worried at all about longevity and looking forward to it.

Growth stock investors can also achieve a similar result by ensuring that their portfolio returns exceeds their withdrawal rate which is usually set at conservative number like 4%. Most investors should be able to beat 4%.

Before planning for retirement past 100, pls do a frank stock-take of:
(1) parents/grandparents age (genetics important)
(2) Your VO2 Max and strength (2 key indicators of longevity)
(3) Annual health check stats (cholesterol, BMI, diabetes)

 

[DevilPlate]

I will only spend my dividend/passive income during retirement and not touch the principal. So I am not worried at all about longevity and looking forward to it.

Yr current lifestyle already like retirement or even better with cushy non stressful job and able to go gym during WFH days