(GPGT)Espresso machine hoot

[wook2000]

The stain is normal, the best way to get rid of it is using Cafiza and soaking the portafilter in it.

Most of the portafilter out there is chrome plated brass as its cheaper to produce. So eventually you will start seeing the peeling away of the chrome plating. Not a big issue, only aesthetically not pleasing.

 

[tremor]

Any opinions between bezzera bz07 de pid vs magica pid?

I’m torn between this 2. One is E61 but the other got dosing.

 

[patryn33]

Any opinions between bezzera bz07 de pid vs magica pid?

I’m torn between this 2. One is E61 but the other got dosing.

Bz07 dosing feature good? Didn’t read but it’s timed or vol? Vol machine can detect how much coffee loaded?
http://www.finecoffeecompany.com/shop/bezzera-bz07-de-pid/

 

[turboo]

The stain is normal, the best way to get rid of it is using Cafiza and soaking the portafilter in it.

Most of the portafilter out there is chrome plated brass as its cheaper to produce. So eventually you will start seeing the peeling away of the chrome plating. Not a big issue, only aesthetically not pleasing.

good to hear it's not poisonous/harmful whatsoever.

Regarding Cafiza, is it just a descaler? As such, does it work if I get any OEM version on Aliexpress instead? even the descaler itself is quite expensive

Also for making of latte art, how do I know what kind of milk pitcher will give me best results/gentler learning curve? E.g. any difference between these 2 selections?

https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?sp...zen8Fn&id=547437127984&ns=1&abbucket=6#detail

https://detail.tmall.com/item.htm?s...532183239&ns=1&abbucket=6&skuId=3114476634043

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Separately, I just tried with fresh beans from Santino and my Helor 101 this morning. Tried twice and it totally failed. No coffee extraction and water exiting from both side and middle of portafilter. Initially thought it was grind size. I tested both 12 and 18 dots. Both also flopped, and I can hear the pressure drop immensely after a few seconds (sounded like the machine gave up on pumping through the basket). Any idea what's wrong?

First video with 21g
https://youtu.be/suKeivdEzRI

Second video with 18g
https://youtu.be/Yl9accoZE4w

 

[wook2000]

Cafiza is not a descaler, it is a very strong detergent to get rid of coffee stains and is not to used in the reservoir at all. A descaler is meant to be used in the reservoir and run thru the machine. Dun worry about scale at this moment, it would take like maybe 5 years before you start seeing any meaningful scale problems with our local water.

Your grinds are way too fine, maybe try 30 dots? i am not too familiar with the Helor, but its definitely too fine a setting, and try to keep at 18g consistently and only adjust the grinder

 

[wook2000]

Any opinions between bezzera bz07 de pid vs magica pid?

I’m torn between this 2. One is E61 but the other got dosing.

Personally for me if given a choice, i would not go for a E61 group head, each time you back flush with cafiza, it will require you to dismantle the lever and oil it. PITA if you ask me.

 

[turboo]

Cafiza is not a descaler, it is a very strong detergent to get rid of coffee stains and is not to used in the reservoir at all. A descaler is meant to be used in the reservoir and run thru the machine. Dun worry about scale at this moment, it would take like maybe 5 years before you start seeing any meaningful scale problems with our local water.

Your grinds are way too fine, maybe try 30 dots? i am not too familiar with the Helor, but its definitely too fine a setting, and try to keep at 18g consistently and only adjust the grinder

Hello, thanks for the suggestion. gona try again tomorrow morning.

Just curious - even if it is super fine, water shouldn't be able to flow through the portafilter, coming out as water right?

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

Hello, thanks for the suggestion. gona try again tomorrow morning.

Just curious - even if it is super fine, water shouldn't be able to flow through the portafilter, coming out as water right?

1) are u using a non-pressurized filter basket? You need to use non pressurised filter basket if you are grinding fine. Remove the crema device in your porta filter too.

2) water is leaking from your porta filter gasket. That’s why it’s clear and dripping from outside your spout. Water was leaking from the sides. Can see this from the video.

3) based on eyeballing seems your are grinding too fine. It cannot be like a Turkish coffee powder. If you compress the grind between your fingers the grinds should not compress to a solid “cake”. Not should u see your finger prints indented on the grinds.

 

[turboo]

1) are u using a non-pressurized filter basket? You need to use non pressurised filter basket if you are grinding fine. Remove the crema device in your porta filter too.

2) water is leaking from your porta filter gasket. That’s why it’s clear and dripping from outside your spout. Water was leaking from the sides. Can see this from the video.

3) based on eyeballing seems your are grinding too fine. It cannot be like a Turkish coffee powder. If you compress the grind between your fingers the grinds should not compress to a solid “cake”. Not should u see your finger prints indented on the grinds.

yup i am using non-pressurized basket. by crema device, you mean the "pressurized pin" in the portafilter?

for the leakage, is it a portafilter problem or because i grind too fine as well?

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

yup i am using non-pressurized basket. by crema device, you mean the "pressurized pin" in the portafilter?

for the leakage, is it a portafilter problem or because i grind too fine as well?

Yes. There should be nothing else between the filter basket and your portafilter spouts. Let your grind setting and the basket be resistance for the water.

The leakage could be 2 reasons, worn out gasket or your did not lock in your portafilter tight enough. I’m guessing your gasket is fine since your machine is new. It could be you did not tighten the portafilter enough. By right no water should leak from the gasket area if you locked in your portafilter correctly. The overpressure valve should take care of any excess pressure (similar to when using the blind baskets) unless the OPV is incorrectly set.

 

[turboo]

Yes. There should be nothing else between the filter basket and your portafilter spouts. Let your grind setting and the basket be resistance for the water.

The leakage could be 2 reasons, worn out gasket or your did not lock in your portafilter tight enough. I’m guessing your gasket is fine since your machine is new. It could be you did not tighten the portafilter enough. By right no water should leak from the gasket area if you locked in your portafilter correctly. The overpressure valve should take care of any excess pressure (similar to when using the blind baskets) unless the OPV is incorrectly set.

Apologies, I mixed up the difference between pressurized vs non-pressurized basket vs pressurized pin.

Just realised the non-pressurized basket didn't come with my Gaggia. I tested again with the pressurized basket, 22-24 dots (on Helor), 15g, and water is leaking from the side. What gives?

The interesting part is that when I used Boncafe/Hook pre-ground coffee, there wasn't any pure water leakage but when I grind my own Santino beans, this happens.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBxykKowg6M


Lastly, I will need to get a non-pressurized basket for my Gaggia. Is there any difference between a ridged and ridgeless basket? Does it matter if I go for IMS/VST/OEM? My research so far tells me the basket only has a very small influence on the output of the espresso. Suggestions welcome!

 

[wook2000]

Apologies, I mixed up the difference between pressurized vs non-pressurized basket vs pressurized pin.

Just realised the non-pressurized basket didn't come with my Gaggia. I tested again with the pressurized basket, 22-24 dots (on Helor), 15g, and water is leaking from the side. What gives?

The interesting part is that when I used Boncafe/Hook pre-ground coffee, there wasn't any pure water leakage but when I grind my own Santino beans, this happens.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBxykKowg6M


Lastly, I will need to get a non-pressurized basket for my Gaggia. Is there any difference between a ridged and ridgeless basket? Does it matter if I go for IMS/VST/OEM? My research so far tells me the basket only has a very small influence on the output of the espresso. Suggestions welcome!

Don't be too concerned with the leaking at the moment, go get a non-pressurized basket first.

Ridgeless is the way to go usually as it makes swapping baskets easier. Go with the OEM basket. Try getting maybe a 20 g and 17g basket first.

 

[sellun]

Hi experts. I have been using Nescafé barista for over a year. Since moving house soon, I'm looking for a easy maintenance machine like Nescafé barista. Anyone can recommend a low level machine that's easy to use? I drink cappuccino everyday using fresh milk. Is delonghi ecp33.21 easy to use and suitable for my usage? Budget below 300.

Prefer to use instant coffee like Nescafé gold blend.

Sent from HUAWEI BLA-L29 using GAGT

 

[turboo]

Don't be too concerned with the leaking at the moment, go get a non-pressurized basket first.

Ridgeless is the way to go usually as it makes swapping baskets easier. Go with the OEM basket. Try getting maybe a 20 g and 17g basket first.

thanks for the advice! When getting a 20g basket, does it mean it performs best when it has exactly 20g of powder? Or should we never go to the max capacity?

Asking because 15g (approx. double) is just nice for me now (taste-wise).

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

thanks for the advice! When getting a 20g basket, does it mean it performs best when it has exactly 20g of powder? Or should we never go to the max capacity?

Asking because 15g (approx. double) is just nice for me now (taste-wise).

The basket weight rating is a very good guide that you can follow first.

However depending on the roast level, grind size and type of beans different weight of beans will fill the volume of the basket differently. Dark roasted beans will take up a lot of volume for the weight (I.e. less dense.)

Golden rule - make sure u don’t overfill the basket which may result in the top of the puck scraping against the shower screen and disturbing the integrity of the puck when u are locking in the portafilter.

Scraping against the shower screen screw is ok (if your machine uses shower screen screws.

I like to full the basket as much as I can without scraping against the shower screen. This is another technique to prevent the flow rate from becoming too fast towards the last 3rd of the extracting process. If you use too little grounds, the grounds will expand in the empty space while u are brewing especially if you preinfuse, resulting in less resistance no matter how fine you grind.

 

[turboo]

I see. Separately, is it harmful to lock the portafilter beyond the midline for the Gaggia? does it have any effect on extraction or machine longevity for example?

P.S: just bought a IMS competition 12/18g basket as it was on offer - assume 15g will be the sweet spot..

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

I see. Separately, is it harmful to lock the portafilter beyond the midline for the Gaggia? does it have any effect on extraction or machine longevity for example?

P.S: just bought a IMS competition 12/18g basket as it was on offer - assume 15g will be the sweet spot..

Hmm...not familiar with gaggia. But with all the machines I used I just lock sufficiently to ensure there is no leakage when I am brewing.

Not all machines get a proper seal at the midline. My machines lock at 7, 6 and 4 o’ clock depending on the portafilter I use.

IMS is a good basket but you may need to grind finer than you normally do. I suppose you can try with 15g first. Lock in sufficiently. Then unlock the portafilter and have a look at the puck to see if it was scraped by the shower screen. Takes some experimentation.

From your videos you seem to be locking in with very little force. It could be the seal is not strong enough.

 

[turboo]

Hmm...not familiar with gaggia. But with all the machines I used I just lock sufficiently to ensure there is no leakage when I am brewing.

Not all machines get a proper seal at the midline. My machines lock at 7, 6 and 4 o’ clock depending on the portafilter I use.

IMS is a good basket but you may need to grind finer than you normally do. I suppose you can try with 15g first. Lock in sufficiently. Then unlock the portafilter and have a look at the puck to see if it was scraped by the shower screen. Takes some experimentation.

From your videos you seem to be locking in with very little force. It could be the seal is not strong enough.

Yup u're right - there's no leakage today. Having went through all these, the taste difference between pre-ground and freshly ground with a fairly expensive Grinder doesn't seem to be as dramatic as I imagined it to be.

https://youtu.be/4XVjcMBKIA4

Thanks for the tip on IMS too. Btw, is there any best practice for transferring of grounds from Grinder to basket/portafilter?

My whole table is always in a mess when I try to empty the Grinder to basket with a brush (while my portafilter is locked and pre-warmed separately). Thinking whether it's overkill to use a funnel to transfer the grounds.

Also wanna check if there's any difference transferring while basket is in portafilter, or only attached after the transfer.

Thanks!

 

[YouHeypiCanLiao]

DO i need to buy the following stuff for maintenace

1. descalez ( clean tank )
2. grindz ( grinder )
3. cafiza ( backflush )

where can get from sg?

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

Yup u're right - there's no leakage today. Having went through all these, the taste difference between pre-ground and freshly ground with a fairly expensive Grinder doesn't seem to be as dramatic as I imagined it to be.

https://youtu.be/4XVjcMBKIA4

Thanks for the tip on IMS too. Btw, is there any best practice for transferring of grounds from Grinder to basket/portafilter?

My whole table is always in a mess when I try to empty the Grinder to basket with a brush (while my portafilter is locked and pre-warmed separately). Thinking whether it's overkill to use a funnel to transfer the grounds.

Also wanna check if there's any difference transferring while basket is in portafilter, or only attached after the transfer.

Thanks!

All else being equal I find the different between freshly ground vs preground being night and day. Maybe try using better quality beans 1-2 weeks post roast.

U can use a yoghurt cup with the bottom cut off to make a funnel to transfer grounds to the porta filter. But there are off the shelf devices for this purpose. Since you use a portable hand grinder it’s messy unless your are very careful. Getting a funnel is not overkill.

No difference to extraction since your will still need to groom your basket. Depending on your grinder it may be easier to transfer to the basket with or without portafilter.