(GPGT)Espresso machine hoot

[Rprime]

Possibly the boiler or group head temperature is too low. Do you by any chance have a thermometer to check it out?

 

[DriftKing]

What machine and grinder are you using? 40-50 sec is way too long, double shots I usually go 20-23 sec. But... maybe its your palette just doesnt like espresso? No matter how bitter it is, espresso still comes with sour taste to it.

 

[sohzai]

Oh.. I taste based on milk based drinks. Espresso I don't know how to differentiate the notes yet.

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[testerjp]

If can over extract for so long still becomes sour, it's the coffee issue.

I ever pulled at 84 degrees on a nutty blend, not really a lot more sour.
Its the choice of beans and roasting.
See when you flush that time, have steam or not, if have wont be too off.

Maybe try flushing minimally. This may "conpensate" a little.

If you don't want the sourness, should aim for darker roast and I think Central American coffee.

 

[DriftKing]

Oh.. I taste based on milk based drinks. Espresso I don't know how to differentiate the notes yet.

Sent from mobile using GAGT

Wa lau, why you got 2 account posting one

 

[CTBR]

prozaizxc, have you tried the coffee made by the roasters using the same blends you bought? Could it be that you just don't like lighter roasts?

 

[prozaizxc]

If can over extract for so long still becomes sour, it's the coffee issue.

I ever pulled at 84 degrees on a nutty blend, not really a lot more sour.
Its the choice of beans and roasting.
See when you flush that time, have steam or not, if have wont be too off.

Maybe try flushing minimally. This may "conpensate" a little.

If you don't want the sourness, should aim for darker roast and I think Central American coffee.

When I flush the grouphead, there is no steam. I'm using a rancilio Silvia and usually what I do is leave it on for about 20-30 mins then flush the group head in intervals of 2-3 sec for 3-4 times until the boiler lights turn on and then once it goes off I'll start brewing. However, I see no steam coming out from the grouphead almost all the time, maybe I'm brewing at too low temperature? So it under extracts although my brew time is long?

 

[prozaizxc]

prozaizxc, have you tried the coffee made by the roasters using the same blends you bought? Could it be that you just don't like lighter roasts?

Actually, no. I've no time to go and try at the cafes I'll try soon and see the taste difference

 

[prozaizxc]

What machine and grinder are you using? 40-50 sec is way too long, double shots I usually go 20-23 sec. But... maybe its your palette just doesnt like espresso? No matter how bitter it is, espresso still comes with sour taste to it.

My espresso has close to 0 bitter taste to it and mostly all sourness.
Yup my shots are 25-30 seconds but I've ever pulled a 1 minute shot and it still tasted sour

 

[prozaizxc]

Possibly the boiler or group head temperature is too low. Do you by any chance have a thermometer to check it out?

I think highly likely this is the problem because when I flush the grouphead there is no steam

No I don't have sadly

 

[prozaizxc]

Try this, grind finer and down dose to 12-13gm. Keep the ratio the same. Lighter roasts are harder to pull right and it might help to do a little WDT if you're not doing it already.

Sent from Samsung SM-N910G using GAGT

Okay I'll try it thanks!
Is nuts and bolts from papa considered light roast?
And any dark roasts to recommend?

 

[sohzai]

Wa lau, why you got 2 account posting one

Huh? What you mean? Lost.......

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[Rprime]

When I flush the grouphead, there is no steam. I'm using a rancilio Silvia and usually what I do is leave it on for about 20-30 mins then flush the group head in intervals of 2-3 sec for 3-4 times until the boiler lights turn on and then once it goes off I'll start brewing. However, I see no steam coming out from the grouphead almost all the time, maybe I'm brewing at too low temperature? So it under extracts although my brew time is long?

I think likely you over cooled it.

Silvia group heads aren't that big and they will loose heat real quick.
Also cooling flush cycle is mostly for HX, silvia temperature surf was actually to overcome the error of its boiler pressure stat so it's a by luck hit or miss thing.
Do warm up your portafilter with the machine and your cups too

You can also explore possibility of installing a PID kit for Silvia in the future.

My espresso machine was set at 105c boiler temperature and when it reaches the group head its around 92-93, some steam would be seen but not a lot.

 

[prozaizxc]

I think likely you over cooled it.

Silvia group heads aren't that big and they will loose heat real quick.
Also cooling flush cycle is mostly for HX, silvia temperature surf was actually to overcome the error of its boiler pressure stat so it's a by luck hit or miss thing.
Do warm up your portafilter with the machine and your cups too

You can also explore possibility of installing a PID kit for Silvia in the future.

My espresso machine was set at 105c boiler temperature and when it reaches the group head its around 92-93, some steam would be seen but not a lot.

How to make the grouphead hotter though?
I thought by doing what I did it was temperature surfing because I saw a video doing that and saying it was temperature surfing

I do heat up the portafilter and cups!

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

How to make the grouphead hotter though?
I thought by doing what I did it was temperature surfing because I saw a video doing that and saying it was temperature surfing

I do heat up the portafilter and cups!

Quite unusual you get sourness all the time. Some blends i've tried have zero sourness. Some is all about fruits and acidity (aka "sourness").

1st do a check of your thermostat to see if its in the correct range and not malfuctioning. Heat machine for 20 mins. When the boiler light immediately goes off, press brew button. Is there super heated water (steam + bubbly water + hissing) coming out of the shower screen? If yes then the thermostat should be within the range and able to heat your water enough.

2nd - Use a medium/ darker roasted blend. Highlander. Papa's nut and boltz, are ok. for even darker traditional stuff try toby's, oriole, or coffee in a place stuff (red bird, perfero, bodka - all are sublime).

Avoid nylon, strangers reunion. Excellent coffee but usually light roasted and not easy to pull a good shot.

3rd - Don't use a flushing technique to get your water to the correct temperature. The flushing technique is quick and dirty way to get temp to ideal but not easy to use may drop boiler pressure too much. Use a temp surf technique.
1. 20 mins to warm up machine (with portafilter inside)
2. When the boiler light goes off, you may start to prep your filter basket. Exactly 2 mins after boiler light goes off, press the brew button and extract the coffee.
If still too sour decrease the waiting time - eg 1min 30 secs, 1 min
If bitter then increase the waiting time. - eg 2 min 30 secs. etc.

4th - Use dose that is appropriate for the basket. Using stock double basket? Keep it to 14-15g. Better still. use stock baskets and keep dose to 15g. (i usually don't advocate extremely low doses although it might solve sourness problems cos i find too much headspace between the top of the puck and shower screen causes channeling).

5th - Keep extraction time between 25-30 secs. Better still. keep extraction time to exactly 30 secs since you are trouble shooting.

6th - keep your brew ratio to 2. 15g dose = 30g of espresso cos you are troubleshooting. Let grind size control flow rate to get 30g of espresso in 30 secs with 15g of coffee.

lastly - try to ensure you don't have an uneven extraction. use a bottomless portafilter. (uneven extraction causes extreme bitterness rather than sourness actually but good practice for consistency to use bottomlesss portafilter).

In general, sourness can be due to:
a. inherent bean characteristic (natural processed, varietal etc).
b. light roast (vegetal kind of acidity may be due to underdeveloped roast).
c. under extraction (AKA low extraction yield - too high dose, too short brew time, too low brew ratio, low brewing temps)

Contrary to visual judgement a very dark sinister slow flowing shot (eg 45sec extraction with very low brew ratio of 1:1) is usually under extracted not over extracted. Flavours may be very intense and bitterness is always picked up first because of the way we perceive different flavours when they are in higher concentration. Sourness is still there actually.

Good luck in your experiments!

 

[chikyblink]

Just got this IMS shower screen and new gasket from chriscoffee. After one and a half years of owning my machine, my gasket has started to harden. As you can see from my old black gasket, a small chip is visible on the left side due to the hardening. Although there's no leaks yet, I thought I'll change it before its too late. And might as well grab the IMS shower screen while I'm at it.

Here it is when they're installed.

 

[BigSword]

Are you a coffee / coffee-making fanatic?

 

[Whisper]

I have some capsules but I do not have the machine. Can I just pour hot water and mix with the capsule contents?

 

[Rprime]

I have some capsules but I do not have the machine. Can I just pour hot water and mix with the capsule contents?

You can, but it would not be drinkable by standards lol!

Yes, You will need a machine catered for the capsule system in order to use the capsules.

 

[Whisper]

You can, but it would not be drinkable by standards lol!

Yes, You will need a machine catered for the capsule system in order to use the capsules.

Not drinkable? Then I better dont try.