jogging and motivation thread

WussRedXLi

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I usually do that for my dips and pull ups. 1 working set now but big one. Hit "failure", shake out lactate and muscle fibres a bit , whack.......hit "failure", shake it out a bit, whack, hit failure, shake it out a bit, whack. Usually can dish out 3X......and after that the 4th is really cannot, proceed to "jump" and just focus on eccentric, can do 2-3 reps of eccentrics, then exercise cut.
 

Mila Azul

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I usually do that for my dips and pull ups. 1 working set now but big one. Hit "failure", shake out lactate and muscle fibres a bit , whack.......hit "failure", shake it out a bit, whack, hit failure, shake it out a bit, whack. Usually can dish out 3X......and after that the 4th is really cannot, proceed to "jump" and just focus on eccentric, can do 2-3 reps of eccentrics, then exercise cut.


That's great that you're still able to stay active. My knee still hurts, so I hesitate to do much. Whenever I feel the pain, I end up giving up. I now just focus on knee rehab exercises that I saw on YouTube, hoping it will work.
 

kaisin82

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This news excerpt describes a conflict at the MOE (Evans) Stadium in Singapore involving a large running group and other individuals trying to use the facility.

The Main Issue A run club, identified by some netizens as the Zephyr Running Club, was criticized for taking up too much space on the running track.

  • The Scale: Photos showed over 25 people occupying seven lanes of the track at once.
  • The Behavior: A runner named "Ms P" complained that the group ran in a long, single-file line that blocked her path. She described them as a "sweaty cluster" that didn't keep a safe distance from others.
  • The Complaint: Ms P felt the group was "colonising" (taking over) the public space and that photographers taking pictures of the runners were an invasion of privacy. She tried to speak to the group, but they were dismissive.
The Response

  • The Run Club: A spokesperson for Zephyr Running Club said they teach their members proper track etiquette (rules of behavior). They expressed disappointment that online comments about the incident had turned into racist and discriminatory attacks against their members.
  • The Public Reaction:
    • Supporters of the complaint: Many people agreed the group was being inconsiderate. Some shared stories of having to dodge the runners or even having their pets accidentally kicked. They argued that public tracks should be shared, not "hogged" by large groups.
    • Supporters of the club: Others felt the runners followed the rules technically. They argued that on a track, faster runners must overtake slower ones, and no single lane belongs to one person. They suggested the real problem was just that the track was too crowded that night.
Key Concepts Explained

  • Track Etiquette:This refers to the unwritten social rules of running on a public track.
    • Lane Discipline: Slower runners usually stay in the inner lanes (closest to the field), while faster runners use the outer lanes.
    • Overtaking: If you are faster, you should pass on the right (in countries driving on the left, like Singapore) or left (in right-hand traffic countries), but you must always signal or ensure it is safe before moving into another runner's path.
    • Group Size: While running alone or in pairs is standard, large groups running together can block the entire track, which is generally frowned upon in shared public spaces.
  • "Colonising" (in this context): The user used this word to describe the feeling of being pushed out of a public space by a large, dominant group. It implies that the runners acted as if they owned the track, ignoring the rights of others to use it.
  • MOE (Evans) Stadium: This is a public sports facility in Singapore managed by the Ministry of Education (MOE) but often open for community use. It features a standard 400-meter running track.
  • Stomp: This is a popular Singaporean news outlet known for reporting on local community issues, often based on tips and photos sent in by the public.
Current Status The situation is unresolved. The news outlet Stomp has contacted SportSG (Sport Singapore), the government agency responsible for managing public sports facilities, to ask for their official stance and whether any rules were broken.

Wah sounds like nothing to complain already, like this also can. Maybe if they are intending to run as a big group, and it is really busy in the stadium, take the outer lane?
 

rECKleSSfElla

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@Mila Azul You pre-ordering the Fitbit Air? There is a Shopee $24 off $150 voucher for their 5.15 sale + 3% coins cashback if you sub to their Shopee VIP. Quite possibly the best deal anywhere for now. Also checked with the Shopee Fitbit store CS and this is their promo. No $45 google store credit but you get an additional band instead.
Dear Customer, here's the promotions for the pre order on this platform: Promotion for New Model Google Fitbit Air (For Pre-order only): • Fitbit Air comes with 3 months of Google Health Premium (at SGD $12.98/mo) Pre-order Offer From 7 May (10:00 PM) to 26 May (9:00 PM), we will offer a f r e e Silicone Active Band (worth SGD $49) with every pre-order of Fitbit Air, while stocks last.
 

sales69

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Just received my Qiaodan Qinghong Free.

Luckily saw a review saying size up for wide feet.

Usually buy 44 but got 45 for this pair.

Toebox ample space. Width at ball of foot just nice. If size 44, would have been too tight.

Length 1 finger width space in front. Doubt will slide in front because already limited at the ball.

Low stack but feels very cushioned. Was expecting firmer but walking in it is quite soft.

Need to run tomorrow and see how.
 

rECKleSSfElla

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@sales69 Have you received and ran in the Dowin Hurricane Max? Like your thoughts on it if you have already done so.

Gonna have to shelf my Redhare 9U. Much as i like it for slow runs, its precisely such that i have been doing predominantly slow runs for the past 2 months. My 80/20 plan has become more like 95/5 lol. Really need to get back to doing more tempo stuff.
 

sales69

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@sales69 Have you received and ran in the Dowin Hurricane Max? Like your thoughts on it if you have already done so.

Gonna have to shelf my Redhare 9U. Much as i like it for slow runs, its precisely such that i have been doing predominantly slow runs for the past 2 months. My 80/20 plan has become more like 95/5 lol. Really need to get back to doing more tempo stuff.
Just received the Hurricane Max, Qinghong Free, BaodiXiangCai today.

Gotta take another week or two to try them out.

Also received the $130 Feidian 6E from PDD. Looks and feels genuine.

But box QR code is scrapped off. Also no size tags on the shoes. My first full priced pair have the tags.

Either the seller is super skillful at removing the tags and sewing threads.

Or it probably wasn't sewed on in the factory. Then it could be a factory overrun stock.

Does have the balance ball feeling when stepping into it, standing on one foot. Should be legit.

I did 3 runs with the R2 Yourun 2.0. This is a damn fine cushioned trainer.

Size 44 only 218g, very light. Every step sink in like 20% into the foam kind of softness. Then immediately bounce back with a somewhat firm platform to feel the push-off.

Slight rocker but not aggressive. Can go fast or slow (7min) no problems.

Can consider if you like cushioning with bounce. Only around $75!

Edit: R2 definitely can do tempo. I did short spurts of 4:45 pace. Don't dare run too much fast yet.



 

rECKleSSfElla

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Also received the $130 Feidian 6E from PDD. Looks and feels genuine.

But box QR code is scrapped off. Also no size tags on the shoes. My first full priced pair have the tags.

Either the seller is super skillful at removing the tags and sewing threads.

Or it probably wasn't sewed on in the factory. Then it could be a factory overrun stock.

Does have the balance ball feeling when stepping into it, standing on one foot. Should be legit.

I did 3 runs with the R2 Yourun 2.0. This is a damn fine cushioned trainer.

Size 44 only 218g, very light. Every step sink in like 20% into the foam kind of softness. Then immediately bounce back with a somewhat firm platform to feel the push-off.
Nice. Considering between 1 of Anta Zone 2 90, Lifeng SL or Yourun 2.0 and 1 of Feidian 6E or Feiying Plaid 3 for 6.18 sale.
 

Ender

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Just received the Hurricane Max, Qinghong Free, BaodiXiangCai today.

Gotta take another week or two to try them out.

Also received the $130 Feidian 6E from PDD. Looks and feels genuine.

But box QR code is scrapped off. Also no size tags on the shoes. My first full priced pair have the tags.

Either the seller is super skillful at removing the tags and sewing threads.

Or it probably wasn't sewed on in the factory. Then it could be a factory overrun stock.
Where is the chip located? I pressed my 5c (rom 3rd party seller) all over, can't feel any hard chip. ALso can't find any place that shows tampering with sewing thread. Both L/R shoes has size tag under the tongue.

As or my 6E from PDD, now in singapore custom since yesterday, it actually arrived in Singapore on Tuesday. So stucked at custom for 2 days. The tracking is frustrating, but I don't want to pay more for air at TB. LOL.
 

sales69

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Where is the chip located? I pressed my 5c (rom 3rd party seller) all over, can't feel any hard chip. ALso can't find any place that shows tampering with sewing thread. Both L/R shoes has size tag under the tongue.

As or my 6E from PDD, now in singapore custom since yesterday, it actually arrived in Singapore on Tuesday. So stucked at custom for 2 days. The tracking is frustrating, but I don't want to pay more for air at TB. LOL.
The China video showed the chip is under the insole, around the forefoot.

I think the video fella did some digging into the top midsole to extract.

For both pairs, the insole is glued in front but not the back.

I also never bother to check. :s13:

Just the balance ball bounce and unstable feeling is enough tell it apart.

Don't think any other shoes can replicate that same feeling.
 

WussRedXLi

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That's great that you're still able to stay active. My knee still hurts, so I hesitate to do much. Whenever I feel the pain, I end up giving up. I now just focus on knee rehab exercises that I saw on YouTube, hoping it will work.

Can still try doing half reps, it might decrease the pain, will still strengthen the muscles (quads and glute max). If it does, then continue doing, it might decrease or even go away. I find that if dont strengthen, the issue will forever be there....i encountered this from around 2010-2016 which i suffered from deteriorating knee pain (going down steps). This was before i started stairs climbing.

At the same time, strength all other parts of the leg, calves, tibs, glutes, hamstrings as well. Over time it should decrease in % any potential imbalances and gradually helps things.

Last time when i started squatting, i also the lower end (deeper part) of the the squat feels a bit pain at the front of the knee. Now no more....as i continued to strenthen all parts of my leg. But then, also, there could be a more serious issue that might need more in-depth addressing if over time it increases instead of decreases, then you see how you wanna address this with a healthcare pro or not.

Oh btw, i dont do any sort of bilateral exercise. All my leg exercises are unilateral one, ie single leg. For squats, that'd be bulgarian split squat. Really helps the spine loading coz basically it is half the load, ie you can really hammer the legs and focus on that, instead of having any limitations on the back or core.
I have cut out single leg deadlifts already, coz i prefer to focus a bit more for quads, in any case i find BSS is more than sufficient for my requirements.
Other than plyo drop jumps, in which bo bian is 2 legged.
 
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WussRedXLi

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Woke up at 430am and ran my ass off.





I woke up at 5am+ and saw the radar, really half decided to go out or not. In the end rained at 7.40am right after i ended my run, luckily call not to bike was correct. If not will be stuck outside, i mean not say stuck lah it was very slight drizzle only for a short while, but for sure the mental pressure will be there.....very miserable to make my way back in such conditions and more importantly risk the bike and with additional crashing risk (esp with traffic). Usually i get home by 8.20am latest and prep for work to reach office by 9.10.

edit - heavy rain now at 8.40 liao.

Somemore today is my workout day, but bo bian.......live to bike another day.

So in the end just ran a fast 4km just now with my wife sua.
 
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WussRedXLi

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@kaisin82

Just came across this (new) vid...... Shd be pretty accurate info.
Exactly what i was talking about earlier in my wall-of-text posts to you 🤣 (paiseh, but dont think it is fruitful to just quickly gloss over things). Multifactoral, but she is dwelling more on the calves aspect.....that's why i mentioned about the calves endurance test, other than the specific strengthening needed.

If you wanna try next time post race, also can. I tested a few times before, have been slowly inching up..... now is around mid 40s reps. I think 30-35 is the bare minimum pure / long distance runners should shoot for. But note, it's gonna get you pretty sore next few days if you are not into strengthening before so do be careful.


She also talked about only heavy + slow calf work producing meaningful adaptations.




Summary​

This video addresses late race fatigue in runners and triathletes, focusing specifically on the calf-Achilles tendon complex and its critical role in endurance running performance. Late race fatigue is multifactorial, involving glycogen depletion, central fatigue, dehydration, thermoregulation, and neuromuscular fatigue. However, this presentation highlights a less discussed but highly trainable mechanical factor: the loss of Achilles tendon stiffness and subsequent calf muscle inefficiency, which significantly increases the metabolic cost of running during prolonged efforts.


Key Concepts and Findings​

  • Durability: A newly recognized key component of endurance performance, defined as the metabolic cost of running increasing over time even at a constant pace.
  • Propulsive Work Distribution:
    • Ankle (via Achilles tendon): ~54%
    • Knee: ~23%
    • Hip: ~23%
  • The Achilles tendon acts as an elastic spring, storing and returning energy passively, which reduces metabolic cost.
  • The calf muscle fibers contract more slowly due to the tendon’s spring action, optimizing muscle efficiency (enthalpy efficiency) at around 20% of maximum shortening velocity.
  • Dynamic creep: After prolonged loading (e.g., 90 minutes of running), the Achilles tendon loses stiffness (~9% reduction), requiring calf muscles to contract faster and more, moving them away from their efficiency sweet spot.
  • This leads to a 1.3% worsening of running economy after 90 minutes, with tendon stiffness explaining 43% of this change.
  • As calf muscles fatigue (up to 19-20% torque reduction after a hard 10k run), the body redistributes work from the ankle to the knee and hip, which are metabolically less efficient.
  • This redistribution is more pronounced in:
    • Less trained runners
    • Runners with weaker calf-Achilles systems
    • At higher intensities
  • Gender differences and running styles affect redistribution patterns (e.g., some female recreational runners shift load directly from ankle to hip, bypassing the knee).

Summary Timeline of Fatigue Mechanism​

StageDescriptionEffect on Running Economy / Mechanics
Fresh StateAchilles tendon stiff, calf muscles contract at optimal speedEfficient propulsion; low metabolic cost
After prolonged loadAchilles tendon undergoes dynamic creep, loses ~9% stiffnessCalf muscles shorten faster, less efficient; metabolic cost rises
Muscle fatigue onsetCalf muscle strength drops (~19-20% reduction after intense runs)Load redistributes to knee and hip; less efficient propulsion
Late race performanceIncreased metabolic cost, potential stride breakdown and fatigue symptomsPerformance declines, especially in long races (marathon, Ironman)

Quantitative Data from Key Studies​

VariableValue / ChangeSource / Notes
Ankle propulsive work~54%Fletcher & Macintosh, 2018
Knee & Hip propulsive work~23% eachFletcher & Macintosh, 2018
Tendon stiffness reduction~9% after 90 minutes runningFletcher & Macintosh, 2018
Running economy worsening1.3% after 90 minutes runningFletcher & Macintosh, 2018
Calf peak torque reduction19-20% after hard 10k runMultiple studies
Redistribution ankle workDrop from 52% to 44% (recreational runners)Seno et al., 2018
Redistribution knee workRise from 29% to 33% (recreational runners)Seno et al., 2018
Redistribution hip workRise from 19% to 23% (recreational runners)Seno et al., 2018
Muscle tendon training results+10% calf strength, +31% tendon stiffness, -4% metabolic costBowman et al., 2021 intervention study

Training Recommendations​

  • Primary focus: Improve plantar flexor muscle strength and Achilles tendon stiffness to delay fatigue-related efficiency losses.
  • Effective protocol (Bowman et al., 2021):
    • Five sets of four isometric ankle plantar flexion contractions
    • 90% maximal voluntary contraction
    • 3 seconds contraction, 3 seconds relaxation
    • 3-4 sessions per week for 14 weeks
  • Results from this protocol demonstrated:
    • 10% increase in plantar flexor strength
    • 31% increase in tendon stiffness
    • 4% reduction in running metabolic cost (significant for performance)
  • Tendon adaptation requires high strain (4.5-5%); lighter, high-rep calf raises are insufficient for tendon stiffness improvements.
  • Alternative or complementary approach:
    • Heavy slow resistance training (1-6 RM, 3s concentric + 3s eccentric tempo)
    • Targets tendon strain through slow, controlled movements
  • Plyometricsimprove stretch-shortening cycle efficiency but should be programmed carefully to avoid overload:
    • Low amplitude, high frequency hops and bounds (e.g., single-leg pogos, A-skips)
    • Avoid excessive volume and allow 48-72 hours recovery between heavy strength and plyometric sessions
  • Whole lower limb strength is essential:
    • Heavy squats for glutes and quads (3-4 sets of 4-5 reps)
    • Hamstring exercises (e.g., curls, staggered stance Romanian deadlifts)
    • Hip abduction/external rotation exercises (e.g., cable hip abduction, side planks)
  • This comprehensive approach supports:
    • Metabolic efficiency
    • Injury prevention
    • Load management when redistribution to knee/hip occurs

Key Insights and Conclusions​

  • Late race fatigue is a complex, multifactorial problem, but the calf-Achilles system plays a central mechanical role.
  • Loss of Achilles tendon stiffness significantly increases metabolic cost before muscle fatigue occurs.
  • Calf muscle fatigue leads to inefficient load redistribution to less economical hip and knee muscles, compounding fatigue and performance decline.
  • Targeted strength training of the calf-Achilles complex can improve tendon stiffness, muscle strength, and running economy by up to 4%.
  • A combined training approach including heavy isometrics, heavy slow resistance, plyometrics, and whole lower body strength is optimal.
  • Tendon adaptations are slow, requiring consistent training over 12-14 weeks or more; benefits are best realized as a long-term commitment.
  • Individual responses vary; programming should be personalized based on athlete needs, pain, recovery capacity, and training context.
  • This approach is particularly valuable for:
    • Runners experiencing late race mechanical fatigue
    • Recreational or older athletes with weaker calf-Achilles systems
    • Triathletes entering running with pre-fatigued calves from cycling

Glossary of Terms​

TermDefinition
Dynamic creepTemporary elongation/stretching of a tendon under repeated loading
Enthalpy efficiencyMuscle efficiency based on contraction speed; how effectively metabolic energy is converted to work
Isometric contractionMuscle contraction without changing length
Plantar flexionMovement of pointing toes downward, involving calf muscles
Stretch-shortening cycleMuscle-tendon action during rapid eccentric-concentric movements, enhancing elastic energy use

This video provides an evidence-based, practical framework to understand and address a key mechanical contributor to fatigue in endurance racing. By improving the calf-Achilles tendon complex's strength and stiffness, athletes can delay fatigue-related metabolic cost increases and better maintain performance in long-distance events.
 
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