Nicole Seah (佘雪玲)

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ponpokku

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The US Marine Corps take 7 months to train a soldier and deploy him to Iraq, where the average tour of duty is about one year. US Army training is comparable too. If that's enough for them why shouldn't it be more than enough for conscripts who probably won't have a single real combat experience in their lives?

Also just look at those US Servicemen who stop over here and compare them to NSFs, they are buffer and stronger even with all the cardio than the average scrawny NSF.

sorry to break ur bubbles, not every US soldier is a marine. the majority of it probably went to national guard or reserves like bush junior. if it takes 7mth and a yr of real combat to make a marine, how long would it take down here in a non-combat condition? double? triple?

simple maths.
 

quendidil

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sorry to break ur bubbles, not every US soldier is a marine. the majority of it probably went to national guard or reserves like bush junior. if it takes 7mth and a yr of real combat to make a marine, how long would it take down here in a non-combat condition? double? triple?

simple maths.

It would take less time, that was what I was trying to imply; why the hell would it take double the time here except through sheer inefficiency?
 

Youareme

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Disappointing with this guy. I agree there are ways to save money, like not have IPPT during re-service, wasting 1/2 day pay & peoples time. They want, they book themselves.

2 years already very compact liao. If squeeze the training shorter, it will be very stressful for the soldiers. Its like squeezing your studies from 3 years to 2 years, by having more subjects per semester. No breathing space.

Actually, the idea of cutting down the term of full-time national service for our boys is not something that cannot be done. What our NSP candidate is suggesting is for our Defense heads to look into ways of implementing the program in a more efficient and productive way, not compromising on national security and capabilities at the same time.

2 years is rather long when you take for instance Taiwan where their boys go through 1 year of conscription.
 

ponpokku

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It would take less time, that was what I was trying to imply; why the hell would it take double the time here except through sheer inefficiency?

oh right, it would take less time to train recruits into soldiers without having a real feel of the battlefield.

just great implications. =:p
 

ponpokku

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erhmm no. Please read up his activities BEFORE he obtained his first office.

kekeke, his activities? he, david, ah lim and one more guy went for the independence talks. according to david, all 4 agreed on total independence b4 hand: we want the whole loaf of bread not 1/2. then 1/2 way thru the talks the brit minister 'ask him out for a meal' or something, he agreed on the internal autonomy and let the other 3 fighting for full independence hung out to dry. he sell his team to the brits and win glory for himself.

david came back kpkb brought out all the docs and insider info, he tulan left the room 1/2 way. thats what he's capable of.
 

quendidil

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oh right, it would take less time to train recruits into soldiers without having a real feel of the battlefield.

just great implications. =:p

You're comparing total time training between Singapore and the US. I'm thinking more about the total time spent in deployment. There's no need to get conscripts to spend 2 years if they aren't going to actually fight. Extend the training duration, perhaps, but actual time spent in vocation doesn't have to be so long -- one and a half years is good enough and it would allow those going to unis to at least not lose so much time compared to the girls.

EDIT- I miscaclulated 7 months. 13 weeks+ 59 days for Marine Infantry is closer to 5 months after which they are assigned to a unit which can be either deployed overseas or in the Reserves. That's for Marines, who undergo the toughest basic training out of all the US military branches.

I have a feeling the people opposed to shortening the duration of NS are largely bitter men who've passed through it already and don't want to see their younger counterparts getting more time than they had.
 
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dadaway

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Now everyone is interested to know what will happen after the elections for these candidates!
 

StarSeeker

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Actually, the idea of cutting down the term of full-time national service for our boys is not something that cannot be done. What our NSP candidate is suggesting is for our Defense heads to look into ways of implementing the program in a more efficient and productive way, not compromising on national security and capabilities at the same time.

2 years is rather long when you take for instance Taiwan where their boys go through 1 year of conscription.

Ok, you have your point. I think he should give some suggestion to support how it can be done.

Some ideas from me:

1) Add PT (especially for male) as a serious part of Poly/ITE or JC education. Train them in such a way that they are prepared for army. Can save maybe 2 months.
Those not schooling, have PT like RT, twice every week.

2) Make NCC & or basic army drill part of secondary education, spread over the cource of 4 years. maybe can save a month on footdrills & basic miliary knowledge.

So BMT can be significantly shorten, & NSF can concentrate on Formation training, Infantry, Armor etc. & Ballation/dive training there after.

3) Administrative & duties not to be done by Combat fit NSF.

Duties like Guards duties, to be a Full time job, like security guard (to be done by Singaporean only), so soldiers can concentrate on their trainings & not burn weekends.
Duty like COS to be done by Downgrade personel, not combat fit soldiers.

So combat soldiers have more time, energy on training, & have more rest time to recharge, & shortening the periods.

What do you guys think of my suggestion?
 

goenitz33

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Cut Down stupid waiting in between activities and you will have alot of time le :p

Cut all those stupid waiting time while waiting for RO and such to be generated and it will also generate alot of time :p

LOL......

Sorry OT :p
 

ponpokku

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You're comparing total time training between Singapore and the US. I'm thinking more about the total time spent in deployment. There's no need to get conscripts to spend 2 years if they aren't going to actually fight. Extend the training duration, perhaps, but actual time spent in vocation doesn't have to be so long -- one and a half years is good enough and it would allow those going to unis to at least not lose so much time compared to the girls.

EDIT- I miscaclulated 7 months. 13 weeks+ 59 days for Marine Infantry is closer to 5 months after which they are assigned to a unit which can be either deployed overseas or in the Reserves. That's for Marines, who undergo the toughest basic training out of all the US military branches.

I have a feeling the people opposed to shortening the duration of NS are largely bitter men who've passed through it already and don't want to see their younger counterparts getting more time than they had.

then obviously u are getting it wrong. preparing for real battle requires intensive training and obviously they had tougher times. in our relatively peaceful environment we had rather slacked training. and u expect to train less time with already less straineous training? without disclosing our training, but a marines clerk would have to fire several hundred rounds to pass his annual shooting trial, even more for those going into live action. they dun even count the rounds down range. for us, we know what happens here when one ends up at a clerk or storeman position.

and i have a gut feeling u knew nothing about military training. :o
 

ponpokku

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Ok, you have your point. I think he should give some suggestion to support how it can be done.

Some ideas from me:

1) Add PT (especially for male) as a serious part of Poly/ITE or JC education. Train them in such a way that they are prepared for army. Can save maybe 2 months.
Those not schooling, have PT like RT, twice every week.

2) Make NCC & or basic army drill part of secondary education, spread over the cource of 4 years. maybe can save a month on footdrills & basic miliary knowledge.

So BMT can be significantly shorten, & NSF can concentrate on Formation training, Infantry, Armor etc. & Ballation/dive training there after.

3) Administrative & duties not to be done by Combat fit NSF.

Duties like Guards duties, to be a Full time job, like security guard (to be done by Singaporean only), so soldiers can concentrate on their trainings & not burn weekends.
Duty like COS to be done by Downgrade personel, not combat fit soldiers.

So combat soldiers have more time, energy on training, & have more rest time to recharge, & shortening the periods.

What do you guys think of my suggestion?

1, our fitness test in sch is qctually quite sufficient preparation for NS, if one can consistently get a silver or above.

2, 12 wks BMT is rather short already.

3, i think guard duty is an important role for combat personnel. learn to watch each other's back and react to abnormal situations. imagine u need contractor securities to babysit ur army, how safe would u feel? dun think it's a good idea.

during my time was 2.5yrs but i think 2yrs should be enuff, cos the last 6mths i basically switched off as daily routines can be done within 2-3 hrs in the morning. after that i senang liao.

most ppl would get to learn 2 or sometimes 3 vocation modules after boot camp, each about 10-12 wks. put another 10-12wks into practice b4 the next. put everything together, plus off days, mc and leave, it will take about 1.5yrs, for bmt and 2 modules, or 2yrs for bmt and 3 modules.

at most cut 2 wks in vocation training and that gives about 2-3mths reduction in total. no practice after the training, it's gonna be a waste.

oh, and unless u want mob-manning to happen more often, we usually had only a few actually happens per yr and most NS men wouldnt be familiar with it if their service is gonna be shorter. unless of cos, we hold mobilisation more often so that it gets into their heads. either u sabo the reservists, or the NS men.
 
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quendidil

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then obviously u are getting it wrong. preparing for real battle requires intensive training and obviously they had tougher times. in our relatively peaceful environment we had rather slacked training. and u expect to train less time with already less straineous training? without disclosing our training, but a marines clerk would have to fire several hundred rounds to pass his annual shooting trial, even more for those going into live action. they dun even count the rounds down range. for us, we know what happens here when one ends up at a clerk or storeman position.

and i have a gut feeling u knew nothing about military training. :o

I am saying, maybe they can extend training, especially for combat units but that is training. Are you saying for riflemen they keep training throughout the two years? Training, I take it to mean actually learning different weapons, techniques etc, not just camping, exercising etc. For non-combat units they're just wasting their time which could be spent studying.
 

lobo76

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i remember after turning 'operational', I spent A LOT of time in my bunk wasting away, going to canteen...
 

ponpokku

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I am saying, maybe they can extend training, especially for combat units but that is training. Are you saying for riflemen they keep training throughout the two years? Training, I take it to mean actually learning different weapons, techniques etc, not just camping, exercising etc. For non-combat units they're just wasting their time which could be spent studying.

that's why i said u got no idea at all. for ur info, probably 1/3 of any fighting force will be involved in logistics. every 1 man will be supporting the other 2 from head to toe, rifle, helmet, backpack, uniform, food, fuel and bunk.

in logistics. the taking care of stores, weaponry, paperwork, equipments, vehicles, food and uniforms all required different levels of training. these work are not very physically demanding but the skills required is much more complicated and required more practice. filling up the forms itself in order to get coordination between different departments can already be a headache. and all these are useful in the future when they join the workforce in the society.

the other 2/3 are suppose to maintain different cycles of training, combat ready. yes they are more physically demanding, but in btw trainings they are more relaxed.

some things only get into ur head with practice. if the active and the logistics didnt even have enuff time training together, u think they can cooperate if there is a need?
 

pete98

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Remembered my NS.

Wake up early. Prepare equipment. Rush to site. Wait for few hours. Do some work. Wait for few hours. Do some more work. Wait for few hours. Pack up and go back camp late. Rinse and repeat.
 

ponpokku

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Remembered my NS.

Wake up early. Prepare equipment. Rush to site. Wait for few hours. Do some work. Wait for few hours. Do some more work. Wait for few hours. Pack up and go back camp late. Rinse and repeat.

yup. in a single excercise besides the personnel, can have thousands of rifles and beds, tents and tens of thousands of uniform, jerry cans and petrol cans. hundreds of vehicles and sometimes boats. all these dun drop from heaven. if these ppl dun train more often to coordinate, the active reach the site oso lanlan suck thumb.
 

Franzz

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IB working overtime, I've gt news Holy Ahgong just crossed the 60k mark as well. :s13:
 
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