Some random facts about 三国

[yummie]

You should quote yummie but not me.
I din support Wei Yan plan either, coz even if he succeed, Shu army cannot withstand waves of reinforcements from Wei on plain land.

Without jingzhou, his plan is definitely fail. He should have some patience and wait for 魏to go down.

but we won't know for sure if wei Yan could succeed..and wei yan crack troops would be a shock force to Wei.

 

[OngHuatHuat]

There was a saying that after the brothers death and the loss of jingzhou. ZGL didn't want to fight the Wei for he knew that it will be unfruitful but he was pressurised by the old guards of Liu bei who wanted to restore Han dynasty.

So he suck thumb and go. His original plan is to take a bit of land each time and that's it. He never intended to occupy Chang An or anything.

Wei Yan smart alec keep want to occupy Chang An.

ZGL know if Wei Yan would do what he want to do after his death and risk the kingdom of shu so order Ma liang to kill him.

This also help Sima Yi who know his intention hence Sima not reactive when the Shu comes because he know ZGL will not go far one

Of course this is a Tiagong only

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Without taking down Chang an, it won't cost any significant damage to 魏。
coz you look at the map, China richest province(not matter ancient time or current time) are on 魏and 吴.

Sometimes I really pity 诸葛亮，he is like pushing to his own limit to fully grow 蜀,but ancient time battle focus too much on soldier number.

 

[OngHuatHuat]

but we won't know for sure if wei Yan could succeed..and wei yan crack troops would be a shock force to Wei.

Even if there is a surprise, 魏army still few times bigger than 蜀，and not to mention he is hitting a gigantic city which is very hard to conquer within a short period of time.

If given long enough time, and people at 蜀is the same as 秦，they can succeed. 秦last time also poor and small, isolated, but eventually become so strong and wiped out the rest of the countries.

 

[cryptocraft]

Without taking down Chang an, it won't cost any significant damage to 魏。
coz you look at the map, China richest province(not matter ancient time or current time) are on 魏and 吴.

Sometimes I really pity 诸葛亮，he is like pushing to his own limit to fully grow 蜀,but ancient time battle focus too much on soldier number.

zgl lost his wars due to his supply line being too long, not so much numbers. he di di tio pwn at cheesan. actually the loss of soldiers came at the hands of jangwei .. useless pos.

 

[yummie]

Even if there is a surprise, 魏army still few times bigger than 蜀，and not to mention he is hitting a gigantic city which is very hard to conquer within a short period of time.

If given long enough time, and people at 蜀is the same as 秦，they can succeed. 秦last time also poor and small, isolated, but eventually become so strong and wiped out the rest of the countries.

but the conditions are different. warring states got 7 states and qin was considered barbarians, shu would be considered like yan, highlands and harsh...and got 7 states, much more politically complicated tan 3 kingdoms.

acutally shu should be very defensive for its survival while building up its population, but we won't know for sure

 

[cryptocraft]

Even if there is a surprise, 魏army still few times bigger than 蜀，and not to mention he is hitting a gigantic city which is very hard to conquer within a short period of time.

If given long enough time, and people at 蜀is the same as 秦，they can succeed. 秦last time also poor and small, isolated, but eventually become so strong and wiped out the rest of the countries.

morever, when it was qin, the north was alot more fragmented. wei was pretty united as a whole.

with you bing ji province, they would have so much more horses too compared to yi zhous ... how to fight on the plains ...

 

[OngHuatHuat]

zgl lost his wars due to his supply line being too long, not so much numbers. he di di tio pwn at cheesan. actually the loss of soldiers came at the hands of jangwei .. useless pos.

No no, not just supply line. Supply line too long is just one of the reasons. Once he passed 凉州，he will face huge number of 魏reinforcements. But the problem is, 司马懿just don let him pass 凉州. You were talking about that few battles at 祁山，I am talking about the whole picture. 蜀won't be able to take down 魏

蜀appears big in that map, coz they include those 少数民族place and mountains.

 

[OngHuatHuat]

morever, when it was qin, the north was alot more fragmented. wei was pretty united as a whole.

with you bing ji province, they would have so much more horses too compared to yi zhous ... how to fight on the plains ...

That's why I said 诸葛亮won't stand a chance at all, why he insisted on 北伐？ just to keep 魏busy? But his own country suffers more than 魏。

 

[OngHuatHuat]

but the conditions are different. warring states got 7 states and qin was considered barbarians, shu would be considered like yan, highlands and harsh...and got 7 states, much more politically complicated tan 3 kingdoms.

acutally shu should be very defensive for its survival while building up its population, but we won't know for sure

秦was started weak and poor as well, but over the years, they improved from one generation to the next generation due to strict rules and regulations. 蜀will stand a chance is they waited longer coz there was internal conflict within 魏.
But frankly speaking, it is really too dificult, unless 魏self pwn.

 

[sleepyhealer]

秦was started weak and poor as well, but over the years, they improved from one generation to the next generation due to strict rules and regulations. 蜀will stand a chance is they waited longer coz there was internal conflict within 魏.
But frankly speaking, it is really too dificult, unless 魏self pwn.

It was due to 商鞅變法which strengthen the country. Unlike Singapore they have too many land too little people so they attract farmers to come by offering free land and take a lower cut than other countries. Then they encourage their own people to be soldiers and the more people they kill the higher their rewards

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[woodzero]

That's why I said 诸葛亮won't stand a chance at all, why he insisted on 北伐？ just to keep 魏busy? But his own country suffers more than 魏。

He insisted on 北伐 because if he doesn't, Shu will be eliminated in the future. He took the chance and gamble as the probability is higher to win than in 50 years time. He mentioned to liu Shan that he could have lie low is xi chuan and live a peaceful life. But xi chuan will not be able to hold on its own if zgl pass away. The fall of Shu started when guan yu attacked Wei and jing zhou was lost to wu. No matter how good is jiang Wei he will still lose in the end. 没天时，没地利 ，没人和.

 

[tokcocksingsong]

TS obviously reading 150s version of Sanguo.

The real Sanguo ish only the elites from the previous incumbent ish si pek beh song Liu Bei and Zhuge Liang. And it ish the previous incumbent that impose high tax on the poor to help the lich.

After Liu Bei and Zhuge Liang create freak result, the table ish turn around. Shu peasants nao pay low tax and elites have to pay higher tax. Land previously seized by elite are now taken back and redistributed for shu peasants to farm. $lavery that use to be norm under the old incumbent ish now abolished and the elite nao kpkb no more peasants willing to work for them. After that ish saw a huge improvement in living standard and wealth for the peasants, productivity ish all time high, and Shu was entering the golden age.

By the end of Shu, peasants kia all love Zhuge Liang dip dip and miss LIu bei golden era. Only the elite ish opposite and urge the last emperor of shu to open door for wei army to march in so that they can regain their higher mortals status.

soulhacker shu shu ftw!

there is a good reason for the number of shrines for ZGL and LB exists

 

[OngHuatHuat]

He insisted on 北伐 because if he doesn't, Shu will be eliminated in the future. He took the chance and gamble as the probability is higher to win than in 50 years time. He mentioned to liu Shan that he could have lie low is xi chuan and live a peaceful life. But xi chuan will not be able to hold on its own if zgl pass away. The fall of Shu started when guan yu attacked Wei and jing zhou was lost to wu. No matter how good is jiang Wei he will still lose in the end. 没天时，没地利 ，没人和.

That is the main reason why liubei so eager take revenge. Coz he wanted 荆州。he knew without jingzhou, the strategy of two pronged attack won't work anymore and he would stuck in 益州forever.

It is so difficult to attack from 益州using land route.

 

[OngHuatHuat]

It was due to 商鞅變法which strengthen the country. Unlike Singapore they have too many land too little people so they attract farmers to come by offering free land and take a lower cut than other countries. Then they encourage their own people to be soldiers and the more people they kill the higher their rewards

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Dunno why you keep linking back to singapore. But one of the reasons why 蜀gg is due to lack of talent to succeed 诸葛亮。

1 姜维is not enough.

 

[yummie]

秦was started weak and poor as well, but over the years, they improved from one generation to the next generation due to strict rules and regulations. 蜀will stand a chance is they waited longer coz there was internal conflict within 魏.
But frankly speaking, it is really too dificult, unless 魏self pwn.

during warring states, none of the 6 remaining states tot of conquering the rest of the 6 states. only Qin tot of it.

in 3 kingdoms, everyone want to unify China as it was started by Qinshihuang. so the lead time to build up ur state is shorter during 3 kingdoms. so it's hard for border generals to stand guard if the king wants to take action

 

[OngHuatHuat]

It was due to 商鞅變法which strengthen the country. Unlike Singapore they have too many land too little people so they attract farmers to come by offering free land and take a lower cut than other countries. Then they encourage their own people to be soldiers and the more people they kill the higher their rewards

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By the way, 商鞅originally not 秦国人as well

 

[yummie]

Dunno why you keep linking back to singapore. But one of the reasons why 蜀gg is due to lack of talent to succeed 诸葛亮。

1 姜维is not enough.

then have to attract talent from the other 2 states, like what happen during the warring states, each were vying for talents from schools and from each other and from their own countries among the common folks

 

[OngHuatHuat]

during warring states, none of the 6 remaining states tot of conquering the rest of the 6 states. only Qin tot of it.

in 3 kingdoms, everyone want to unify China as it was started by Qinshihuang. so the lead time to build up ur state is shorter during 3 kingdoms. so it's hard for border generals to stand guard if the king wants to take action

Your this reply got point.
But the problem with 蜀is that it is so much easier to defend than attack. Why can't they use 秦strategy to attract people over and eventually grow until super strong?

 

[Toiletpaper80]

My chinese teacher also say 曹操 very strong and had a very good pair of legs. He can run a 1000 li in a single day.



















because 说曹操曹操就到.

this is funny~

 

[OngHuatHuat]

then have to attract talent from the other 2 states, like what happen during the warring states, each were vying for talents from schools and from each other and from their own countries among the common folks

When I was young, I ish really 年少无知，thought one 诸葛亮really can destroy the balance. When I grow older, I realize it is system, ie the political and economy structure that will bring you far. 诸葛亮is really a very good governor, his method also 以法治国，but they need money to sustain army. During his time, army : common folks ratio is around 1: 7 which is insanely high. If he doesn't need to 北伐, but just focus on building defense, his expenses on military can cut down a lot.