Will minimum wage laws work here?

[t32321795]

I support minimum wage. I talked to a school cleaner, she got 6 upskill certificates but still earning the same.

Haidilao offering high salary for cleaner, she can apply there

 

[ThinkMe]

Ya sia EDMW more correct must listen.

Posted from PCWX using Mi MIX 2S

 

[KnyghtRyder]

It's actually very simple to understand. Someone needs to pay for the increased if there's a min wage. If not the middle class then it's the upper class, or both. However, since it hurts the middle class more than the upper class, and it forms the bigger part of our society, it makes sense that it is paid much more by the upper class. However, in a capitalist society, if u pinch the upper class, they'll just pay lower salaries to the middle class, and so it'll be back to square one. Another way could be via a slight increase in taxes for the upper class so that it'll be used to fund the min wage. But since our gov belongs to this upper class they'll rather not do anything.

Then the only solution is revolution?

 

[sharpsnapper]

Singapore total labour workforce 3.67 million including all FW and FT.

There were 2.33 million residents in the labour force as of June 2019, comprising 1.97 million Singaporeans and 360,000 PRs. Jan 23, 2020

Important number is 1.97 million Singaporeans.

 

[fox1]

so what if there ish price increase? as long as ur income can cover ish can liao.

price increase, then minimum wage increase lor.

then price increase, again minimum wage increase lor.

 

[KnyghtRyder]

Explain to me how minimum wage will make the pie bigger, cause it sounds to me like only redistributing the pie, ie zero sum game.

Because when rich buggers get money.. they squirrel it away.. it doesn't do anything.. pie doesn't change..

But when poor people get money.. they spend it.. they buy things that they urgently need but have been putting off.. spending churns money back into the economy. The pie gets bigger.

 

[Linguist]

lol.. again flawed

say with min wage you wan to fire the sinkie right.. but you still need people to do the job what.. so you hire who?

FW!! thats the answer you probably gonna give. go read my past replies. if a comlany can hire fw and have enough quota.. they wont hire the sinkie already. the reason why they hire locals is either the job requires or they dont have enough quota.. and these requirements are there with or without min wage

your argument only stands if companies PREFER to hire locals first before FW and because of min wage they reverse their decision. while we can say that for higher positions but definitely not in the low wage sectors.

try remove quota.. u see without minw age companies still hire fw. thats why there is quota.. so companies cannot just fire and replace locals. else want quota for what?

1 end you implement quota then you say if u implement minw age suddenly yohr quota will disappear?

I thought the other argument is that more FW are taking PMETS jobs than sinkies?

+ the min wage is really for those low skilled workers like cleaners, construction workers etc.

And they are really living a tough life, with the bosses living at a high end life. Be considerate.

 

[sunzoner]

another way to be considered, let's say a minimum wage is 1000/mth for 1 pax to sustain minimum standard of living (or living wage)... we don't implement the full 1000, but instead maybe just 600-700? then supplement it with other schemes, like progressive wage, workfare and comes up with a combined or new scheme. it doesn't have to be an absolute implementation of 1 method.

Posted from PCWX using EVR-L29

It shift the burden of the increase to tax payers instead of the consumer of the goods or services produced.

Imagine, I collect money $100 from you every month to give to some random persons on the street vs you pay $1 more everytime you purchase something from that person. In the first situation, you cant make a decision on whether it is worth the money or not, while in the second situation, you can make a decision.

Plus, the first situation ties the financial support to the party while the second do not. Ever wonder why the low wage workers are firm supporter of PAP?

 

[notical]

I do not think that the crux of the problem lies with minimum wage, or workers.

I think that the main cause is due to the large influx of foreign "talents" who are either unqualified, inexperienced, not required since role can be performed by locals, or here in Singapore on a long term basis (they should be in Singapore on a short contract basis of a few years to transfer their skills over to locals).

 

[pureice]

The Workers’ Party calls for all working Singaporeans to receive a minimum take-home wage of $1,300 per month for full-time work and pro-rated for part-time work. This helps over 100,000 Singaporeans that currently earn less than $1,300 to meet their basic needs.

Chey only for less than 1300. With just 100k sinkie getting paid more and pro rate to part time. Pls lah whats the incremental in cost to companies.

Cleaner already get min 1200. $100 for a cleaner that probably serve up to 10 stores.

Would that cost cause hawker food to triple? If yes than I think let's skip that hawker store ok . I am sure there are shops that can absorb the difference.

The more relevant context will be: this 100K people, how many will be unemployed, as business balance out their cost. Instead of hiring 2 or part timers/interns/apprenticeships, i hire 1 to take on 2/3 jobs. Look at MOM data for a better representation - they organise by job scope

some of the older peps who just wans to supplement their family income will lose jobs as employers demand a higher value of work due to the cost increase? If they price the cost into your daily food, woudnt the purchasing power of this 100K people remain the same? And since foreigners no need minimum wage, wouldnt biz be now "incentivise" to hire fw? Sole propritorships who use to hire 3rd party sgreans for manual work, now cannot. Have to look for cheaper alternative.

Let this WP economist tell us the estimated social cost bah, mai smoke us with what meta analyse from US labour market perspective. SG got no natural resources nor the kind of labour mobility they have. And yes ours is 2.5% unemployment. Not US 14% unemployment rate.

 

[SGuy1976]

Then the only solution is revolution?

Revolutions are always started by the middle class not the lower class.

 

[wwenze]

Minimum wage is redistribution of wealth. Inflation is an effect and result because that makes capital worth less but labor worth more.

Which is bad for labor exploitation sorry I mean inheritance sorry I mean meritocracy.

 

[fox1]

I do not think that the crux of the problem lies with minimum wage, or workers.

I think that the main cause is due to the large influx of foreign "talents" who are either unqualified, inexperienced, not required since role can be performed by locals, or here in Singapore on a long term basis (they should be in Singapore on a short contract basis of a few years to transfer their skills over to locals).

Foreigners unqualified for what jobs?
They earn less than 1300 or more than 1300.

 

[~Dragonite~]

Jamus has said it too. Prices would go up.

again answer is simple

1) if costs go up, price goes up, consumer pay higher price. consumers not affected. then obviously sinkies are rich enough yet still always demand cheap stuff.

2) if cost goes up, prices goes up, consumers not willing to pay higher price. profits drop. then management needs to find a way how to keep costs lower without exploiting their lowest wage employees.

3) if costs goes up, prices remain same, consumers not affected. company only earn less profits. who gives a fug?

 

[notical]

Foreigners unqualified for what jobs?
They earn less than 1300 or more than 1300.

There is a difference between Foreign Workers, Foreign "Talents", and Foreign Talents. Which are you referring to?

 

[sharpsnapper]

It's Capitalism.. Someone needs to be paying them ... i can assure you 100% if we will to increase our full time cleaner from $900-$1300 that's $400 more for each cleaner.. if i have 40 cleaners that $16.000 more overhead... and u think the cleaning company are willing to absorb them.. what about cpf contribution to them.. ?

Sometime you cannot just look at the overall pictures..

You are saying it is too painful, too much money to give 100,000 low salary workers some extra money?
And everyone is happier that degree holders and Directors have their $7000 and $30,000 monthly salary.

 

[evildoer]

U dunno those who open cleaning companies are big boss? Drive what car?

it doesn't matter what car or how rich they are.. it's capitalism.. i can tell u 1000% they are willing to absorb the cost...


actually cleaning contract are very open.. u can easily gauge the cost and their profit.. if average cleaner is $900.00 u need 3 cleaners ... if the tender price is between $6000 - $9000 would be still reasonable.. but if u quote $15,000
u will not win the contact... so competitive out there..

So the boss say okay they are willing to absorb all the cost without passing on the client... ? IMPOSSIBLE...

 

[wwenze]

Minimum wage is bad. This means my foreign investments profits can buy less stuff in this country. Why should I bring in more foreign money into this country?

 

[fox1]

There is a difference between Foreign Workers, Foreign "Talents", and Foreign Talents. Which are you referring to?

Which one are you referring to?
Now is talking minimum wage.
The foreigners you referring to are 1300 (Jamus minimum wage) level?

That's what I'm finding out from you.
I'm not referring to anyone, finding out from you that's why the question.

 

[nowonderkid]

Meanwhile minimum wage for minister is ok. TS, karma is real.