EV or ICE car

singaporean11

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actually every ev brand got their fair share of kaboom and chinese brands kaboom which is very very common in China was very downplayed on social media, douyin due to their strong PR and legal dept(police even use black cloth to cover the car).
Tesla EVs also kaboomed so many times (and even Mercedes EVs) despite people paying a premium of double the price compared to those China's cars like from BYD :unsure:

No wonder Tesla bought BYD's batteries and only use them in Tesla premium cars like Model Y but not in cheaper models like Model 3.
 

eversomighty

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Fret not, because BYD dealers now offer 10-years free servicing and 10-years battery warranty! :LOL:

Does Tesla cars come with 10-years battery warranty? I don't think so since my understanding is that Tesla's battery is less efficient and not as good as CATL and BYD's batteries. (note that there are some Tesla cars that actually come with BYD batteries as Tesla bought some BYD batteries for use in their more premium cars like Tesla Model Y!)
I mentioned in a few post way ahead that for Warranty 99% of the time, AD can find a way to void it. They can easily push it to u that u have charge the battery to 100% causing it to degradation. Being a smarter car, all charging data(anything below 20% and above 80% is damaging) will be recorded. Battery can be referred only to the cell itself and when they fix it, they can only fix it to make sure it will move and not up to 100% battery efficiency. Even with warranty, AD still can charge u manpower and its up to them on how much it cost. Why I know? Cos I was from the car industry myself and those terms and conditions are partly from me as well. Don't trust marketing too much la. What CATL and BYD battery tech, a lot of times, Chinese figures.. I think most people will understand how much brownie points has been added in and published. 自己讲自己爽 Their words, their research, your money.
 

singaporean11

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I mentioned in a few post way ahead that for Warranty 99% of the time, AD can find a way to void it. They can easily push it to u that u have charge the battery to 100% causing it to degradation. Being a smarter car, all charging data(anything below 20% and above 80% is damaging) will be recorded. Battery can be referred only to the cell itself and when they fix it, they can only fix it to make sure it will move and not up to 100% battery efficiency. Even with warranty, AD still can charge u manpower and its up to them on how much it cost. Why I know? Cos I was from the car industry myself and those terms and conditions are partly from me as well. Don't trust marketing too much la. What CATL and BYD battery tech, a lot of times, Chinese figures.. I think most people will understand how much brownie points has been added in and published. 自己讲自己爽 Their words, their research, your money.
So I suppose you mean that the same is true for electric batteries of cars like Tesla, MG, Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Volkswagen, Ford electric vehicles etc.?

If this is true, scary indeed! :eek: Since Tesla is using a lot of CATL and BYD electric batteries in their Tesla cars especially the premium models like Tesla Model Y!

And BMW is also using CATL batteries!

Mind you, CATL and BYD supplies more than 50% of all electric batteries used in EVs produced all around the world (including US, Germany, and France cars' companies)!
 
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Maaasa

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It's like telling Usain Bolt you fastest man in the world for 100m so what? You are not the fastest in the world for 10km so you are not fast.

AKA 强词夺理.

Just let them pretend they drive at 250km/hr everyday.
🤦‍♂️ whenever i see people recommend ev due to being fast. when 99.9% of the road users have slow reaction time and thinks that it is ok to be at lane 1 at 90km/h to 120km/h

just because i felt the hyundai kona pick up is comparable to a 250hp ice, i should recommend it?

523hp seal with $5588 road tax which can do 0-100 at 3.8s but top speed is 180km/h vs a 250hp $1202 road tax ice 0-100 at 6.2s with 250km/h top speed. I should recommend the seal just because it can get from 1 traffic light to another in the shortest time? people should not rec ev over ice due to it being fast when most of it does not even have the capacity to be fast.
 

eversomighty

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So I suppose you mean that the same is true for electric batteries of cars like Tesla, MG, Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Volkswagen, Ford electric vehicles etc.?

If this is true, scary indeed! :eek: Since Tesla is using a lot of CATL and BYD electric batteries in their Tesla cars especially the premium models like Tesla Model Y!

And BMW is also using CATL batteries!

Mind you, CATL and BYD supplies more than 50% of all electric batteries used in EVs produced all around the world (including US, Germany, and France cars' companies)!
My point is ADs will push high cost warranty responsibilities to users and u will be the one who kana end of the day. But since u so confident of CATL and BYD, go get them lo. U fret not mah.. got warranty. U almost like a paid spokesperson liao..
 

drkcynic

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🤦‍♂️ whenever i see people recommend ev due to being fast. when 99.9% of the road users have slow reaction time and thinks that it is ok to be at lane 1 at 90km/h to 120km/h

just because i felt the hyundai kona pick up is comparable to a 250hp ice, i should recommend it?

523hp seal with $5588 road tax which can do 0-100 at 3.8s but top speed is 180km/h vs a 250hp $1202 road tax ice 0-100 at 6.2s with 250km/h top speed. I should recommend the seal just because it can get from 1 traffic light to another in the shortest time? people should not rec ev over ice due to it being fast when most of it does not even have the capacity to be fast.
You can say whatever you want and go buy whatever you please.

But practically nobody buys a car in SG because he wants to be driving at 250km/hr. I have read loads of rubbish in EDMW, but the level of delulu you have shatted out is on another level. 😅
 

V_for_Vanilla

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I mentioned in a few post way ahead that for Warranty 99% of the time, AD can find a way to void it. They can easily push it to u that u have charge the battery to 100% causing it to degradation. Being a smarter car, all charging data(anything below 20% and above 80% is damaging) will be recorded. Battery can be referred only to the cell itself and when they fix it, they can only fix it to make sure it will move and not up to 100% battery efficiency. Even with warranty, AD still can charge u manpower and its up to them on how much it cost. Why I know? Cos I was from the car industry myself and those terms and conditions are partly from me as well. Don't trust marketing too much la. What CATL and BYD battery tech, a lot of times, Chinese figures.. I think most people will understand how much brownie points has been added in and published. 自己讲自己爽 Their words, their research, your money.
You mentioned you were in the car industry. An interesting news caught my attention recently. Exxon is considering selling off it's network of petrol stations in Spore. Is this a harbinger of things to come?
 

drkcynic

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I mentioned in a few post way ahead that for Warranty 99% of the time, AD can find a way to void it. They can easily push it to u that u have charge the battery to 100% causing it to degradation. Being a smarter car, all charging data(anything below 20% and above 80% is damaging) will be recorded. Battery can be referred only to the cell itself and when they fix it, they can only fix it to make sure it will move and not up to 100% battery efficiency. Even with warranty, AD still can charge u manpower and its up to them on how much it cost. Why I know? Cos I was from the car industry myself and those terms and conditions are partly from me as well. Don't trust marketing too much la. What CATL and BYD battery tech, a lot of times, Chinese figures.. I think most people will understand how much brownie points has been added in and published. 自己讲自己爽 Their words, their research, your money.
Another extremely weird statement. According to you 99% of the time AD can find a way to void warranty?

Heng for all my 4 previous cars, the AD honoured the warranty each time. I must be super lucky to be part of the 1% for all 4 cars.

What are the odds? :spin:
 

eversomighty

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You mentioned you were in the car industry. An interesting news caught my attention recently. Exxon is considering selling off it's network of petrol stations in Spore. Is this a harbinger of things to come?
Big companies off load its assets from time to time based on the CEO and board wants and demands or if its policies linked, political. I do know Chinese petrol companies are keen to expend its retails here. Good timing, I guess?
 

eversomighty

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Another extremely weird statement. According to you 99% of the time AD can find a way to void warranty?

Heng for all my 4 previous cars, the AD honoured the warranty each time. I must be super lucky to be part of the 1% for all 4 cars.

What are the odds? :spin:
When its a high cost repair, the slimmer chance the ADs will take it on la. Of cos ICE car repair are more modular parts based so cost wont be that scarily high compared to battery powered cars. Example, Blade batteries are stack and packed neatly into the platform, god knows how long will the car stays in the workshop. Lighter alloy are used around the newer cars and making repairs tougher to repair compared to older heavy steels.
 

LoUsyGamER

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ROFL. still arguing on EV and ICE. Both got pros and cons. dont need to brainwash each other. Just spend your money based on your beliefs.

Wait this thread becomes ev cults or ice cults.
 

HMAN

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huh battery is the core integral of ur ev car secondary or maybe even more impt than powertrain. dun think there are standardised compliance yet for the industry to follow. different battery chemistries, size, power output, capacity, dimensions how to re-use or swap legally or safely. insurance also dunnoe will cover or void another unclear area for bevs. so u r bind to that battery have to hope the manufacturer keep enough reserves in china after they change their production lines. i doubt so since they keep coming up with new batteries with different chemistries and composition every few months with new models. n very likely once adoption pick up outside china, govt or industry will come up with safety or chemical standards for battery manufacturer to follow ur old battery cars might fail to meet the standards = gg

ya tesla is better since at least they dun chut new model every other quarter n their china battery suppliers dun dare to offend their big customers.
Singapore don't have the know how, likely to adopt European standard.
Current EV battery are based on lithium ion based safety design guidelines.


Lithium ion battery Safety standards have been around for decade and consistent.

For your information, Tesla has stringent requirements over battery swapping, it must be recertified otherwise the car will reject the battery, likewise supercharger will deny charging the unknown battery pack.

Car totalled will have its critical part- battery being barred from redeployment.


I am quoting current Tesla practices, how they deal with premature battery degradation and upgrade.
They do provide newer battery type to replace EOL battery per what I highlighted to provide LFP battery than NCM battery. However this is a downgrade if your car performance required the higher power dump.

NCM has higher discharge and charging rate than LFP , performance EV will usually use NCM lithium battery.
 

eversomighty

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ROFL. still arguing on EV and ICE. Both got pros and cons. dont need to brainwash each other. Just spend your money based on your beliefs.

Wait this thread becomes ev cults or ice cults.
honestly I don't have a thing for any of them.. buy what u like to believe lor cos I have seen too many dirty stuffs on a daily basis across a couple companies then :LOL:
 

drkcynic

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ROFL. still arguing on EV and ICE. Both got pros and cons. dont need to brainwash each other. Just spend your money based on your beliefs.

Wait this thread becomes ev cults or ice cults.
The thread title is "EV or ICE car" but nobody should discuss them here? ROFL indeed. :ROFLMAO:
 

gz0707

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You mentioned you were in the car industry. An interesting news caught my attention recently. Exxon is considering selling off it's network of petrol stations in Spore. Is this a harbinger of things to come?

there's a lot of context going into this discussion, maybe it is worth some research to know what are the factors out there that will affect the direction or costs vs performance (or safety) in the local cars that we are looking to buy. I am pro-ish EV, since SG is a small enough state to facilitate short distance travel and quick charging. some points to consider

- many ppl may not USA is actually the largest oil producer in the world, when Trump takes office, is he pro EV or pro oil export? This may affect Tesla pricing (see China's subsidy on China made EV)
- a lot of rumours online that BYD will demand cost cutting from its suppliers from 2025 onwards - will this affect safety functions or quality of its cars going forward?
- in 2017, there were as many as 487 EV brands in China, now there said is about 48 ev brands left. If you were to purchase a brand such as Skyworth, Seres or even Nio - will they be around afterwards for you to claim warranty?
- last but not least, the speed of improvement is fast that what u buy now may be redundant in a few years eg I have heard a single Polestar Gen 1 owner is losing up to 140k only after 2 year of ownership. Due to high local taxes, most of the EV now fall within 150k to 200k plus - who much will the new buyer loses when battery life range is increased from 450km (now) to 700 km in next few years. Eg have heard the top end spec Aion V will have a range of up to 720km and its launching globally this year.
 

paperplane1943

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Amused at the amount of misinformation.

Anyway, EV or ICE, each got their own supporters but pure ICE going to be phased out right?

should be comparing EV vs Hybrid
 

tkdboi

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there's a lot of context going into this discussion, maybe it is worth some research to know what are the factors out there that will affect the direction or costs vs performance (or safety) in the local cars that we are looking to buy. I am pro-ish EV, since SG is a small enough state to facilitate short distance travel and quick charging. some points to consider
- many ppl may not USA is actually the largest oil producer in the world, when Trump takes office, is he pro EV or pro oil export? This may affect Tesla pricing (see China's subsidy on China made EV)
- a lot of rumours online that BYD will demand cost cutting from its suppliers from 2025 onwards - will this affect safety functions or quality of its cars going forward?
- in 2017, there were as many as 487 EV brands in China, now there said is about 48 ev brands left. If you were to purchase a brand such as Skyworth, Seres or even Nio - will they be around afterwards for you to claim warranty?
- last but not least, the speed of improvement is fast that what u buy now may be redundant in a few years eg I have heard a single Polestar Gen 1 owner is losing up to 140k only after 2 year of ownership. Due to high local taxes, most of the EV now fall within 150k to 200k plus - who much will the new buyer loses when battery life range is increased from 450km (now) to 700 km in next few years. Eg have heard the top end spec Aion V will have a range of up to 720km and its launching globally this year.

the last point is very true but I guess it can be argued too that ICE cars will further lose their value as more switch to EVs for various reasons. think it is inevitable I feel regardless.


Read HWZ Forum Rules!
 

HMAN

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🤦‍♂️ whenever i see people recommend ev due to being fast. when 99.9% of the road users have slow reaction time and thinks that it is ok to be at lane 1 at 90km/h to 120km/h

just because i felt the hyundai kona pick up is comparable to a 250hp ice, i should recommend it?

523hp seal with $5588 road tax which can do 0-100 at 3.8s but top speed is 180km/h vs a 250hp $1202 road tax ice 0-100 at 6.2s with 250km/h top speed. I should recommend the seal just because it can get from 1 traffic light to another in the shortest time? people should not rec ev over ice due to it being fast when most of it does not even have the capacity to be fast.
I . The turbo charged 300 to 500hp power cars tuned with 2000-2500 cc engine are real fun to drive( local or Malaysia highway pursuit) but they have the shortcomings of slight turbo lag. I played turbo charged cars for 15 years, fortunate to have full ECU/ tuning access. For my own cars, I opted a well balance between street drivability & crazy power chase.
High power ICE at NSHY is very very addicted.( EV losing out at speed beyond 200).. but Singapore start/stop traffic with heavy manual clutch is a nono.

Overall experience or practicality still lose to EV.
I don't own BYD seal performance because of the 180km/h speed limit but I don't hate this car, it is still a practical performance car suited for different market needs.

Life move on with EV .
 
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