(GPGT)Espresso machine hoot

[prozaizxc]

Best to turn on full blast. The milk must be as cold as possible. I chill my pitcher in the fridge too. The air must be introduced as early as possible. don't be shy to introduce alot. Once the milk gets to body temp you can't really add any more air into the milk and get the air to integrate well. This is when you can plunge your steam tip slightly lower and maintain the swirl to break down the large bubbles and integrate the already created bubbles into the milk to create micro foam.

I find the silvia actually easier to steam than a two hole tip VBM.. Maybe because there is more lead time to steam.

Thanks for the tip!
Right now i can't get much air into the milk even though I'm hearing the loud stttt stttt sound.
Only managed once to froth really nice milk so far out of a almost 10 tries
Gonna keep practicing for now to get nice milk before even thinking of making any latte art haha!

 

[prozaizxc]

I think my problem with frothing milk is that the steam coming out from the silvia isn't powerful enough.
Anybody knows how long should i wait before to usethe steam wand after i on the steam function button?
Immediately after the boiler lights go off? When I'm steaming milk halfway, the boiler light frequently kicks in and i can hear a sound, like the machine is labouring, like theres not enough steam being created.

 

[chikyblink]

I've never use the Silvia. But here's a suggestion if it's worth anything.
Right after the light goes off for steam, run a little water through the grouphead to make the light come on again. Once the light comes on, steam immediately. The light should stay on throughout the steaming process I think? Making the steam power more consistent?

Sent from Samsung SM-N910G using GAGT

 

[prozaizxc]

I've never use the Silvia. But here's a suggestion if it's worth anything.
Right after the light goes off for steam, run a little water through the grouphead to make the light come on again. Once the light comes on, steam immediately. The light should stay on throughout the steaming process I think? Making the steam power more consistent?

Sent from Samsung SM-N910G using GAGT

If i run water through the grouphead while its on the steaming mode the grouphead will produce steam instead of water? So its just like a sizzling sound.
Ive tried again and turned on the steam function and waited 3-4 minutes after the light went off and it produced more steam.
Probably it needs more time to make the steam but will the boiler burn out if i leave it on too long?

 

[Lastwishes]

How much milk are you steaming at once? if anything, I hear the silvia's steam is usually too powerful if you're making enough milk for only one cup. I haven't tried the machine, so this is just a guess.

What chikyblink suggests is a form of temp surf for the silvia. The purpose of getting the grouphead running for a while is to deplete the heat to get the boiler started.

I've read of silvia users doing that (and I guess it applies to most single boiler machines) - they time how long it takes for the boiler light to turn off - lets say its 40 seconds in theory to do that.

About 30 seconds from the time the boiler light turned on again, they start the steaming. Purpose to have the boiler heating while you're steaming, so the heat is being constantly replenished while you're steaming the milk. The boiler usually heats up faster than what is being depleted, so at some point of time, the boiler light is going to turn off again, but this way you should have more than enough power over the duration of steaming your milk.

 

[prozaizxc]

How much milk are you steaming at once? if anything, I hear the silvia's steam is usually too powerful if you're making enough milk for only one cup. I haven't tried the machine, so this is just a guess.

What chikyblink suggests is a form of temp surf for the silvia. The purpose of getting the grouphead running for a while is to deplete the heat to get the boiler started.

I've read of silvia users doing that (and I guess it applies to most single boiler machines) - they time how long it takes for the boiler light to turn off - lets say its 40 seconds in theory to do that.

About 30 seconds from the time the boiler light turned on again, they start the steaming. Purpose to have the boiler heating while you're steaming, so the heat is being constantly replenished while you're steaming the milk. The boiler usually heats up faster than what is being depleted, so at some point of time, the boiler light is going to turn off again, but this way you should have more than enough power over the duration of steaming your milk.

Im steaming about 5-6 ounces of milk. Most of the time the milk gets hot already before I've even incorporated enough air into it haha. But now that I know to let the boiler heat up whilst I'm steaming I'm getting more air quicker!

 

[Lastwishes]

Im steaming about 5-6 ounces of milk. Most of the time the milk gets hot already before I've even incorporated enough air into it haha. But now that I know to let the boiler heat up whilst I'm steaming I'm getting more air quicker!

the silvia should have more than enough power for that amount of milk.

this should be a good read.

Rancilio Silvia Espresso Machine Review • Home-Barista.com

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

Im steaming about 5-6 ounces of milk. Most of the time the milk gets hot already before I've even incorporated enough air into it haha. But now that I know to let the boiler heat up whilst I'm steaming I'm getting more air quicker!

I recall some initial versions of the v3 Silvias came with a 3 hole tip. But rancilio changed it back to the one hole tip cos here is not enough power for the small boiler to sustain the steaming power. May wanna check if it's a 3 hole tip.
If can also lose a lot of steaming power to suck air into the mix if the tip hole is right against the wall of the pitcher.

 

[derazor]

How much milk are you steaming at once? if anything, I hear the silvia's steam is usually too powerful if you're making enough milk for only one cup. I haven't tried the machine, so this is just a guess.

What chikyblink suggests is a form of temp surf for the silvia. The purpose of getting the grouphead running for a while is to deplete the heat to get the boiler started.

I've read of silvia users doing that (and I guess it applies to most single boiler machines) - they time how long it takes for the boiler light to turn off - lets say its 40 seconds in theory to do that.

About 30 seconds from the time the boiler light turned on again, they start the steaming. Purpose to have the boiler heating while you're steaming, so the heat is being constantly replenished while you're steaming the milk. The boiler usually heats up faster than what is being depleted, so at some point of time, the boiler light is going to turn off again, but this way you should have more than enough power over the duration of steaming your milk.

Can't advise as I don't temp surf.

So far from what I do , 1 or 2 cups, obviously 2 cups takes a much longer time. Confirm Silvia is strong enough. I don't even dip it for more than 2s.

For my case, if the steam temp is about 140C, when the temp goes to 127/126. It should be good enough. Take note it's for 1 cup of milk settings

 

[derazor]

If i run water through the grouphead while its on the steaming mode the grouphead will produce steam instead of water? So its just like a sizzling sound.
Ive tried again and turned on the steam function and waited 3-4 minutes after the light went off and it produced more steam.
Probably it needs more time to make the steam but will the boiler burn out if i leave it on too long?

Normally after you do a pull.
Time start till you steam. The Delta is about 2 - 3mins mins should be fine.

 

[prozaizxc]

the silvia should have more than enough power for that amount of milk.

this should be a good read.

Rancilio Silvia Espresso Machine Review • Home-Barista.com

Read that before i got the machine but now that I've played with the machine and I'm reading it again I'm understanding more of what is says haha thanks!

I recall some initial versions of the v3 Silvias came with a 3 hole tip. But rancilio changed it back to the one hole tip cos here is not enough power for the small boiler to sustain the steaming power. May wanna check if it's a 3 hole tip.
If can also lose a lot of steaming power to suck air into the mix if the tip hole is right against the wall of the pitcher.

Its a one hole tip and i don't think its against the wall. I think I've found the problem which is that i went to steam right after the boiler light went out but i should be waiting 50-80 seconds longer as per what the article that lastwishes posted

Can't advise as I don't temp surf.

So far from what I do , 1 or 2 cups, obviously 2 cups takes a much longer time. Confirm Silvia is strong enough. I don't even dip it for more than 2s.

For my case, if the steam temp is about 140C, when the temp goes to 127/126. It should be good enough. Take note it's for 1 cup of milk settings

What do u mean by don't dip it for more than 2s? You do the aeration part more and the mixing part you do it for less than 2 seconds?

 

[prozaizxc]

Also, I'm pretty curious about this, what if for example i should be getting a brew ratio of 1:3 and I'm using a 14g dose and am supposed to get an output of 42 ml but my grind is slight too coarse for the " theoretical perfect grind size" and my tamp is slightly too hard and so I'm getting an output of 42ml and between a 20-30sec shot. So my output is exactly what i should get but my grind and tamps are slightly off but they offset and compensate each other. How would the espresso's taste be affected?

 

[derazor]

Read that before i got the machine but now that I've played with the machine and I'm reading it again I'm understanding more of what is says haha thanks!


Its a one hole tip and i don't think its against the wall. I think I've found the problem which is that i went to steam right after the boiler light went out but i should be waiting 50-80 seconds longer as per what the article that lastwishes posted



What do u mean by don't dip it for more than 2s? You do the aeration part more and the mixing part you do it for less than 2 seconds?

My aeration is only 2s and then I dip liao....

 

[derazor]

Espresso ratio
is like 1 : 2 ( typically )

More
Brewing ratios for espresso beverages - Home-Barista.com

Say Coffee bean is 16g, U will get 32g of espresso

Milk ratio
is like 1 : 3 to 5

Say Milk is 32 x 5 = 160g ( for me is inclusive of foam la )

I will give you an estimate since I'm using the PID

Time start ( Temp at 105 C )
Normally I cut off my espresso about 25s~.
Then quickly switch on the Steam function.
When stop watch is 2mins ( Temp is 140C ), the heating is already done and then I go and steam the milk. Milk stops at 2:50s.

So more or less maybe you can estimate from my process.

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

Also, I'm pretty curious about this, what if for example i should be getting a brew ratio of 1:3 and I'm using a 14g dose and am supposed to get an output of 42 ml but my grind is slight too coarse for the " theoretical perfect grind size" and my tamp is slightly too hard and so I'm getting an output of 42ml and between a 20-30sec shot. So my output is exactly what i should get but my grind and tamps are slightly off but they offset and compensate each other. How would the espresso's taste be affected?

Firstly the ratio thing makes more sense if you use weight to measure your output instead of using volume. Volume is inaccurate and changes within the 1st 30secs after the shot is brewed when the crema settles.

Honestly besides lowering the flowrate i don't think people are in agreement on how a harder tamp will affect the taste. finer particles are supposed to assist with extraction and may have longer extration time. harder tamp will make it harder for water to pass thru thus extending the extraction time so does that leads to more extraction? hard to answer without the refractometer.
Even with a refractometer measuring same level of extraction between the 2 different situations, i think the taste can still differ depending on what was extracted out of the 30% of solubles.
I guess best to go with taste, experiment alot, perfect the technique for consistency and change only 1 variable at a time.

 

[derazor]

Firstly the ratio thing makes more sense if you use weight to measure your output instead of using volume. Volume is inaccurate and changes within the 1st 30secs after the shot is brewed when the crema settles.

Honestly besides lowering the flowrate i don't think people are in agreement on how a harder tamp will affect the taste. finer particles are supposed to assist with extraction and may have longer extration time. harder tamp will make it harder for water to pass thru thus extending the extraction time so does that leads to more extraction? hard to answer without the refractometer.
Even with a refractometer measuring same level of extraction between the 2 different situations, i think the taste can still differ depending on what was extracted out of the 30% of solubles.
I guess best to go with taste, experiment alot, perfect the technique for consistency and change only 1 variable at a time.

My basket is ridged so how hard you temp is limited.

 

[prozaizxc]

My aeration is only 2s and then I dip liao....

whoa, thats quick, ill try that haha.

Espresso ratio
is like 1 : 2 ( typically )

More
Brewing ratios for espresso beverages - Home-Barista.com

Say Coffee bean is 16g, U will get 32g of espresso

Milk ratio
is like 1 : 3 to 5

Say Milk is 32 x 5 = 160g ( for me is inclusive of foam la )

I will give you an estimate since I'm using the PID

Time start ( Temp at 105 C )
Normally I cut off my espresso about 25s~.
Then quickly switch on the Steam function.
When stop watch is 2mins ( Temp is 140C ), the heating is already done and then I go and steam the milk. Milk stops at 2:50s.

So more or less maybe you can estimate from my process.

Alright, thanks for the info!

Firstly the ratio thing makes more sense if you use weight to measure your output instead of using volume. Volume is inaccurate and changes within the 1st 30secs after the shot is brewed when the crema settles.

Honestly besides lowering the flowrate i don't think people are in agreement on how a harder tamp will affect the taste. finer particles are supposed to assist with extraction and may have longer extration time. harder tamp will make it harder for water to pass thru thus extending the extraction time so does that leads to more extraction? hard to answer without the refractometer.
Even with a refractometer measuring same level of extraction between the 2 different situations, i think the taste can still differ depending on what was extracted out of the 30% of solubles.
I guess best to go with taste, experiment alot, perfect the technique for consistency and change only 1 variable at a time.

Yeah, i use a scale to measure the volume. When should you stop the shot though. When the flow is still blonde?

My basket is ridged so how hard you temp is limited.

Are you using the basket that came with the machine?

 

[derazor]

Are you using the basket that came with the machine?

That's my "stock" basket, not sure what is yours. But anyway don't worry too much about the tamping. Not much significance I feel.

To train the 30g, bend your arm 90 degree, put tissue on your weighing scale and train the force

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

Yeah, i use a scale to measure the volume. When should you stop the shot though. When the flow is still blonde?

I usually just stop extraction at 30secs. THen i see the weight of the output to see if its within the target. Then taste.

I find it difficult to stop at blonding point cos its very subjective. Depends on the roast level too. But one thing i observed with vst baskets is that up to a certain point (usually 25-35secs) the flow will suddenly suddenly appear watery when u observe from a bottomless portafilter.

How do you use a scale to measure volume? the scale can only measure weight. in grams.

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

That's my "stock" basket, not sure what is yours. But anyway don't worry too much about the tamping. Not much significance I feel.

To train the 30g, bend your arm 90 degree, put tissue on your weighing scale and train the force

Or use a calibrated tamper. but as razor mentioned not much difference unless you tamp at the extremes (feather light or gorilla).

I find nutating with a bit of force before tamping makes a bigger difference to the flow rate. .