jogging and motivation thread

[Kuudere]

Interesting...... in 2023 only 8 "amateurs" broke 3 for men in SG (these include ex SEA games fellas or TEAM Singapore / subset Singapore Athletics)....discounting those local record holders like SRY or Benjamin Khoo who probably have very good genetics and excellent background etc.

For 2023/2024, no women broke 3 in SG. A few came very close tho.
edit - basically same story for 2022

Or if we take 2:45 overseas as the standard in which you pretty much can be confident that you have a very good shot in breaking 3 locally.
Edit - not a pro, i just eyepower some PB examples, it might even be closer to 20 mins / 2:40 overseas

So breaking 3 in SG for hobbyists like us with no serious background other than just following some plans and having good consistency seems like it's quite the barrier / bragging rights in the local context where you need to juggle family and career or at least your sian day job.

And when some might finally be able to retire early and have loads of time to pursue these endurance hobbies (eg lets just take age 55), it's nearly impossible by then.
Or if you age 40 kena Toto grp 1 then power lah dey.


And of coz, if you are just basing it off 1 single certified race per year ie SCSM , then lagi forget it...... by sheer probability alone you are already down that much. Anything screw up like it rains or nutritional absorption screw up or wanna cramp but it's still not full blown type, it's bye bye unless you have trained much and have lots of buffer.

https://www.threads.com/@sagecanaday/post/DEN9YawRXyJ?hl=en

Sage coached many people over the years and he recommended 85-100k/week of mileage, for a shot at breaking sub-3 overseas. 100-130k/week to gun for 2:40s, at which point should be realistic volume to go for sub-3 marathon in Sg.

So far, I only know two friends in my running circles that average 85-100k/week and both don't have family commitments (single by choice) and have solid work-life balance. One of them owns his business so have flexible schedule to run.

Apart from this, whether you get into injury and hamper your training performance is another matter altogether. The friend who owned business ran 30k (sg weather) in 4:15-4:16 min/km pace and was gunning for sub 3-hour marathon this year until he encountered an injury which set him back to running 3 times a week.

There are of course, some local runners that have fantastic marathon PR that don't run competitively in Sg. Know of 1 guy - Derek Li, ran 2:39 marathon and 1:14 HM overseas. Given the weather in Sg, it's not too surprising really.

 

[Kuudere]

True also, but I'm running at KL Stan chart this year which, is technically overseas but still going to be lagi hot..

Can try hong kong stan chart, the weather I heard is pretty good to run a fast time there. Pretty sure there are a number of local runners that go for it, so might be worth a shot.

 

[Ender]

Previously brought up the stability issue of Qiaodan 强风 3TR during my review of this shoes when I tried it out for 2 runs. @Ender and @xllms also brought it up.

Did a few more runs. Now I'm down with mild tendonitis on my left ankle (Posterior tibial tendon). Feel tenderness when pressed or when ankle is taking weight, especially during stairs climbing.

Either there is not enough arch support/stability, resulting in excessive inward rolling (pronation) which is what I felt when running, or I had increased my mileage by too much/too fast recently.

Just felt the need to bring this up, for people who have stability issues. This shoes might not be a good options...

This shoes, I find if you are either under or over pronator, it will amplify the pronation.

The deep sunk in at the heel has a risk of over loading the Achilles's tendon.

Rotate in a firmer, lower stack shoes. Hopefully that will help to carry on running.

I will use this shoes for shorter runs first before upping the mileage in it. Hopefully can acclimatize my feet.

 

[Ender]

True also, but I'm running at KL Stan chart this year which, is technically overseas but still going to be lagi hot..

Don't think it's the best course for PB, but all the best for your race.

 

[WussRedXLi]

1 more hour!!!

 

[WussRedXLi]

Fwah carl lewis now like that liao

I still remember him and Ben Johnson last time back in the 80s Olympics i think.

 

[WussRedXLi]

https://www.threads.com/@sagecanaday/post/DEN9YawRXyJ?hl=en

Sage coached many people over the years and he recommended 85-100k/week of mileage, for a shot at breaking sub-3 overseas. 100-130k/week to gun for 2:40s, at which point should be realistic volume to go for sub-3 marathon in Sg.

So far, I only know two friends in my running circles that average 85-100k/week and both don't have family commitments (single by choice) and have solid work-life balance. One of them owns his business so have flexible schedule to run.

Apart from this, whether you get into injury and hamper your training performance is another matter altogether. The friend who owned business ran 30k (sg weather) in 4:15-4:16 min/km pace and was gunning for sub 3-hour marathon this year until he encountered an injury which set him back to running 3 times a week.

There are of course, some local runners that have fantastic marathon PR that don't run competitively in Sg. Know of 1 guy - Derek Li, ran 2:39 marathon and 1:14 HM overseas. Given the weather in Sg, it's not too surprising really.

Currently watching the sub-4 attempt by Faith Kipyegon. heh...... wah lao still gotta wait another 40 mins.
But nvm la, sleep recovery take 1 day backseat.

Currently i am doing ~ 15hrs per week for cycling, but quite a fair bit is weekends with kid and those are somewhat junk (Z1) coz my kid not that strong/fit yet. It used to be nearer to 20hrs/week last time.
For weekdays, i can afford to dish out 2.5 every day no issue and still can fit my schedule. Together with a bit of strengthening (20 mins) and for running is my home/office commute ard 1k per leg including for lunch which i also gun some very short hill sprints and then once a week some short but fast intervals.

Even 2.5 x 5 = 12.5hrs at just 6:00 very easy pace Z1-ish to low Z2 for eg,...tat is already 120km/week already.
But then for me, no way that is possible for me to do for running. I will lose interest/focus.


Cyclists generally do a lot of hours (volume), for one reason or another that i am not sure...... my 15hrs/wk is actually nothing compared to some of the other fellas.
This is one of the more popular cycling channels done by a Malaysian. Really crazy things that their group do.
https://www.youtube.com/@AlvinAWWY

For eg, their 12-days tour of MY. 2000km, +8000m elevation gain. Totally crazy.
You can divide that mileage by around 3 to 3.5 to convert to running mileage for the speeds that they are doing (aero drag/energy expenditure increases exponentially as speed increases but tyre/drive drain drag increases linearly)
But of coz, a lot of their members got pro background, some ex national level even (1 is ex TDF team) and 1 zhar boh actually still representing MY national team in track cycling.

But there is one major drawback for the majority of MY and SG cyclists, many are very sleep deprived one due to the nature of the rides coz of road cycling. Bo bian. That means pretty sub-optimal recovery for the number affecting factor, sleep. For me i already try not to start so early liao for the early rides for weekends, earliest is 5am i wake up but mostly 5.45 nowadays. Weekdays i usually do nights.





Some other crazy local fellas
But all these are really for fun. Training aspects, i dont think got any +ve advantages. heh. Dont get injured due to massive volume spike already arm chio liao. (of coz these guys easily do 300-400km per week usually)

 

[WussRedXLi]

4:06:91

Just use a truck lah. I see this pretty often on WCH. The first time i saw this i was shocked, i pedalling for my life already and the other cyclist just zoomed past me behind the truck.

 

[Mattitude]

Really very hard to break the sub-4 mile for female! Need to push really hard!

 

[rarenick]

Currently watching the sub-4 attempt by Faith Kipyegon. heh...... wah lao still gotta wait another 40 mins.
But nvm la, sleep recovery take 1 day backseat.
Currently i am doing ~ 15hrs per week for cycling, but quite a fair bit is weekends with kid and those are somewhat junk (Z1) coz my kid not that strong/fit yet. It used to be nearer to 20hrs/week last time.
For weekdays, i can afford to dish out 2.5 every day no issue and still can fit my schedule. Together with a bit of strengthening (20 mins) and for running is my home/office commute ard 1k per leg including for lunch which i also gun some very short hill sprints and then once a week some short but fast intervals.
Even 2.5 x 5 = 12.5hrs at just 6:00 very easy pace Z1-ish to low Z2 for eg,...tat is already 120km/week already.
But then for me, no way that is possible for me to do for running. I will lose interest/focus.
Cyclists generally do a lot of hours (volume), for one reason or another that i am not sure...... my 15hrs/wk is actually nothing compared to some of the other fellas.
This is one of the more popular cycling channels done by a Malaysian. Really crazy things that their group do.

For eg, their 12-days tour of MY. 2000km, +8000m elevation gain. Totally crazy.
You can divide that mileage by around 3 to 3.5 to convert to running mileage for the speeds that they are doing (aero drag/energy expenditure increases exponentially as speed increases but tyre/drive drain drag increases linearly)
But of coz, a lot of their members got pro background, some ex national level even (1 is ex TDF team) and 1 zhar boh actually still representing MY national team in track cycling.
But there is one major drawback for the majority of MY and SG cyclists, many are very sleep deprived one due to the nature of the rides coz of road cycling. Bo bian. That means pretty sub-optimal recovery for the number affecting factor, sleep. For me i already try not to start so early liao for the early rides for weekends, earliest is 5am i wake up but mostly 5.45 nowadays. Weekdays i usually do nights.

Some other crazy local fellas
But all these are really for fun. Training aspects, i dont think got any +ve advantages. heh. Dont get injured due to massive volume spike already arm chio liao. (of coz these guys easily do 300-400km per week usually)

Training cycling must pump up the volume to improve endurance in z2 z3 heart rate via adaptation. But so many Singaporeans only want pride during weekends. Many of them ride z4 for majority of the time, because they want to catch up with their group friends who are usually faster (deemed as performance upgrade). They are not willing to train their endurance hence never improve their overall speed and then struggle alot during group rides. To them the companionship and pride are more important than health. Oh wait, still haven't factored in sleep deprivation. No matter how much you train, how well you performed, without enough sleep your health is still affected. Be it high cortisol or blood pressure etc. It is better not to train or to train in low intensity when lack of sleep. This is not even about staying alert to watch out for traffic. All these add together is a recipe for health and safety disaster.

 

[sph777]

https://www.threads.com/@sagecanaday/post/DEN9YawRXyJ?hl=en

Sage coached many people over the years and he recommended 85-100k/week of mileage, for a shot at breaking sub-3 overseas. 100-130k/week to gun for 2:40s, at which point should be realistic volume to go for sub-3 marathon in Sg.

So far, I only know two friends in my running circles that average 85-100k/week and both don't have family commitments (single by choice) and have solid work-life balance. One of them owns his business so have flexible schedule to run.

Apart from this, whether you get into injury and hamper your training performance is another matter altogether. The friend who owned business ran 30k (sg weather) in 4:15-4:16 min/km pace and was gunning for sub 3-hour marathon this year until he encountered an injury which set him back to running 3 times a week.

There are of course, some local runners that have fantastic marathon PR that don't run competitively in Sg. Know of 1 guy - Derek Li, ran 2:39 marathon and 1:14 HM overseas. Given the weather in Sg, it's not too surprising really.

Interesting thread. This year I am aiming for sub 3:30 in stan chart, should have broken last year if I wasn't sick. Now I am averaging 60-70km per week of running which is almost max out given work and family commitments.

True also, but I'm running at KL Stan chart this year which, is technically overseas but still going to be lagi hot..

As mentioned by the rest, same weather haha but all the best nonetheless.

only overseas one I every year ballot is for tokyo. Hopefully one of these years can get.

 

[WussRedXLi]

Highlights of the sub-4 attempt

 

[WussRedXLi]

Training cycling must pump up the volume to improve endurance in z2 z3 heart rate via adaptation. But so many Singaporeans only want pride during weekends. Many of them ride z4 for majority of the time, because they want to catch up with their group friends who are usually faster (deemed as performance upgrade). They are not willing to train their endurance hence never improve their overall speed and then struggle alot during group rides. To them the companionship and pride are more important than health. Oh wait, still haven't factored in sleep deprivation. No matter how much you train, how well you performed, without enough sleep your health is still affected. Be it high cortisol or blood pressure etc. It is better not to train or to train in low intensity when lack of sleep. This is not even about staying alert to watch out for traffic. All these add together is a recipe for health and safety disaster.

Luckily for me i started off with walking and then running, so in a sense those taught me to be slow n patient and learn the science behind it.
Yes too fast for too long....short surges by itself is not too bad or detracts from the nature of the session from all the vids i have come across.

But to be fair it is quite hobbyist + "social" in nature so i get their feeling. Cafe rides or proper grp rides with pace groups (same as running groups) actually ok, i think less damage done vs the hammer ones say like CCP5 .... but i still get it anyway since it's also a hobby.
CCP5 is like 40k. If talking about proper polarized training, we are talking like another 200km of base at least, possibly 250km even for some folks (eg me, older folks or those who cannot recover well from serious workouts susceptible to injury etc).....coupled with good volume, polarization is literally king.
But of coz, for time crunched individuals, just doing a fair bit of interval type of rides (eg surgey rides) still works, just not optimal.....say esp in cycling context where the vast majority of group rides are so bloody long.
Good % of Z2 Z3 also trains durability a fair bit better based on good volume.

For health, there is another point regarding Z2, that is fat burning, for those who wants to lose weight/cut body fat%. Just more efficient and effective this way.

 

[ferocity]

Previously brought up the stability issue of Qiaodan 强风 3TR during my review of this shoes when I tried it out for 2 runs. @Ender and @xllms also brought it up.

This shoe is unusable for me. Go for 1st run in it end up with small wounds on heel and ankle due to excessing rubbing. Was wearing low ankle socks so i thought maybe would be better if i wear full length thick socks. Tried another run with normal socks still getting the feeling of rubbing. Probably will put this aside and only use it for slow walks or sneakers for daily wear.

 

[xllms]

This shoe is unusable for me. Go for 1st run in it end up with small wounds on heel and ankle due to excessing rubbing. Was wearing low ankle socks so i thought maybe would be better if i wear full length thick socks. Tried another run with normal socks still getting the feeling of rubbing. Probably will put this aside and only use it for slow walks or sneakers for daily wear.

shoe too big?

 

[xllms]

Luckily for me i started off with walking and then running, so in a sense those taught me to be slow n patient and learn the science behind it.
Yes too fast for too long....short surges by itself is not too bad or detracts from the nature of the session from all the vids i have come across.

But to be fair it is quite hobbyist + "social" in nature so i get their feeling. Cafe rides or proper grp rides with pace groups (same as running groups) actually ok, i think less damage done vs the hammer ones say like CCP5 .... but i still get it anyway since it's also a hobby.
CCP5 is like 40k. If talking about proper polarized training, we are talking like another 200km of base at least, possibly 250km even for some folks (eg me, older folks or those who cannot recover well from serious workouts susceptible to injury etc).....coupled with good volume, polarization is literally king.
But of coz, for time crunched individuals, just doing a fair bit of interval type of rides (eg surgey rides) still works, just not optimal.....say esp in cycling context where the vast majority of group rides are so bloody long.
Good % of Z2 Z3 also trains durability a fair bit better based on good volume.

For health, there is another point regarding Z2, that is fat burning, for those who wants to lose weight/cut body fat%. Just more efficient and effective this way.

me been running too much in z3 & z4, now trying to build up my base in z2 during this punishing summer. Hopefully can see results during end autumn. Have to admit its super tough maintaining HR within z2 with runs of more than 15km in temp above 30degC. Felt so drained after 18km.

 

[ferocity]

shoe too big?

Fit feels just about right for me. Funny thing is the rubbing and subsequent wounds only appear on my right feet while the left feet feels normal. Last thrown of dice maybe switch out the insoles and see if it helps.

 

[xllms]

Fit feels just about right for me. Funny thing is the rubbing and subsequent wounds only appear on my right feet while the left feet feels normal. Last thrown of dice maybe switch out the insoles and see if it helps.

did you try adjusting shoe laces, eg. tightening or loosening.
everyone's left and right feet are different, eg. my left is slightly larger than right, and left supinate more than my right, resulting to faster wearing off on my left outer heel.

 

[Mephist0pheLes]

Highlights of the sub-4 attempt

the last 5 or 6 pacers look like they can all break 4 easily.

 

[rarenick]

Luckily for me i started off with walking and then running, so in a sense those taught me to be slow n patient and learn the science behind it.
Yes too fast for too long....short surges by itself is not too bad or detracts from the nature of the session from all the vids i have come across.
But to be fair it is quite hobbyist + "social" in nature so i get their feeling. Cafe rides or proper grp rides with pace groups (same as running groups) actually ok, i think less damage done vs the hammer ones say like CCP5 .... but i still get it anyway since it's also a hobby.
CCP5 is like 40k. If talking about proper polarized training, we are talking like another 200km of base at least, possibly 250km even for some folks (eg me, older folks or those who cannot recover well from serious workouts susceptible to injury etc).....coupled with good volume, polarization is literally king.
But of coz, for time crunched individuals, just doing a fair bit of interval type of rides (eg surgey rides) still works, just not optimal.....say esp in cycling context where the vast majority of group rides are so bloody long.
Good % of Z2 Z3 also trains durability a fair bit better based on good volume.
For health, there is another point regarding Z2, that is fat burning, for those who wants to lose weight/cut body fat%. Just more efficient and effective this way.

It's a bell curve also, sure got 1 or 2 super unfit who are struggling to keep up. I worry for them.

Group rides 3 to 5 hours including break(s). High cortisol and also burn muscles away.

Z2 fat burning is more efficient/effective only when the person is willing to put in more time in doing it. If no time, then do HIIT.