(GPGT)Espresso machine hoot

[YouHeypiCanLiao]

Fans of dark roasts, which are your favorites? I normally drink lattes, with long blacks an alternative.

So far Arcaffe Margo is my favorite. Love the very earthy and chocolatey notes. Very forgiving blend too. But I feel it's goes flat fast, which is bad cos the min size is 1kg from FCC. Very competitively priced.

Dutch Colony's dutch and colonial blends are a little too tart and acidic for me. Maybe it's my grinding though.

Homeground's Vanta is pretty good. Bold and creamy. Long blacks work pretty well with it too, with good notes of floral and balanced acidity.

Trying Common Man's blends now.

what is FCC how much?

 

[prozaizxc]

bottomless filter is a good learning tool but try not to overanalyse. Its only one of the tools that you can use to assess for even distribution. Taste is the ultimate indicator of good extraction. You already suspected some of the reasons for the less then perfect looking espresso pulls.

A few reasons why you are not getting a good pattern on your bottomless. not all of them are related to your technique or getting a good extraction!:
1. Using light roasted beans - Try using a medium to darker roast. I recommend using Ona Coffee Hitman, highlander coffee for consistent results. these are easy to brew with. Yes home ground does go for lighter roast style. lighter roasts are harder to extract properly
2. Using old beans - 7-21 days post roast date is ok.
3. Using water that is too cold - When using the silvia you have to time when to pull the shot.
4. using vst - Yes using a VST basket may result in inconsistent results because of the high surface area of the basket that is perforated and makes it much easier for liquid/dissolved/undissolved solids to pass thru. If you get it right VST baskets allows you to get good results for light roast coffee because you have to grind finer.
5. Disturbed puck due to too high coffee bed - Adjust your dose so that your shower screen does not touch your puck and disturb its integrity when you lock in your portafilter.
6. Disturbed puck due to no preinfusion - this is less of a problem but still a potential one. Your puck may have been disturbed with the shock of sudden pressure hitting the puck disturbing its integrity.
5. and Finally - uneven distribution - use WDT. I use it all the time for consistent results.

Hmm thanks for the advice. Actually in my shots there are often channelling that occurs. But I feel that my workflow is pretty alright and the only way to improve is to change grinder (which i am not going to do as I already have a macap M4 which is decent enough for me), or buy a coffee distributor tool and a PUSH tamper for even tamping (though both tools are too expensive imo for what they do and doesn't justify its high price). The following is the steps that i take.

1. Grind
2. Empty doser into a plastic 58mm cup
3. overturn cup into a portafilter and shake it up to produce an even bed (think the forward pushing motion while making fried rice in a wok to "flip the rice") - learnt this while i was working in a cafe part time
4. WDT with a toothpick - only did this after reading your post - any tips on how to do it best? i.e what motions to do and is there such thing as stirring too much?
5. tap the portafilter a couple times
6. tamp (i put the tamper flat and then press with my palm on the top of the tamper) - gives a pretty even tamp)
7. Brew.

^ while doing these steps today, the portafilter basket fills up evenly initially - indicating that it is not an uneven tamp and that the grinds are distributed well. But there were some dead spots still and small spritz of channelling. However, the taste is pretty good so i guess i shouldn't look too much into this. Of course, looking forward to when there is no channeling in my shots and it should taste even better. Shot time on a home ground roast was 21 seconds with 18g in and 40g out. Will try a darker roast for my next bag of coffee and see if adding WDT into the routine makes the coffee extraction nicer as I wasn't doing it as I watched Matt Perger's videos and he said that tapping is enough and WDT wasn't necessary but after doing it, my shots looked better and will continue doing so.

 

[chikyblink]

To prevent dead spots, I find NOT tapping helps.
Also, when doing wdt, don't do it with the toothpick all the way down, scraping the bottom. With the toothpick a little more than halfway down is enough.
The reason for dead spots is fines clogging the holes.

Sent from HUAWEI CLT-L29 using GAGT

 

[skate87]

After 2 years of deliberation, finally jump the gun and bought my first real espresso machine and also upgrade my grinder. Didn't go for zero retention grinder as I'm not so discerning in taste. I drink milk base 100% of the time.

It's shipping to me now from Italy. Bought from Espresso Coffee Shop. Should receive my next Monday.

Bought these:
Rocket Appartamento Nera
Rocket Faustino

Upgraded from stupid appliance that don't let me do much.
Delonghi Dedica 680
Breville Smart Grinder Pro

Saving up for machine so looking around - for foreign sets, if need servicing, where/how can you get it serviced? That's my only concern as the price is really great!

 

[Wryer]

what is FCC how much?

Google for finecoffeecompany.

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

Hmm thanks for the advice. Actually in my shots there are often channelling that occurs. But I feel that my workflow is pretty alright and the only way to improve is to change grinder (which i am not going to do as I already have a macap M4 which is decent enough for me), or buy a coffee distributor tool and a PUSH tamper for even tamping (though both tools are too expensive imo for what they do and doesn't justify its high price). The following is the steps that i take.

1. Grind
2. Empty doser into a plastic 58mm cup
3. overturn cup into a portafilter and shake it up to produce an even bed (think the forward pushing motion while making fried rice in a wok to "flip the rice") - learnt this while i was working in a cafe part time
4. WDT with a toothpick - only did this after reading your post - any tips on how to do it best? i.e what motions to do and is there such thing as stirring too much?
5. tap the portafilter a couple times
6. tamp (i put the tamper flat and then press with my palm on the top of the tamper) - gives a pretty even tamp)
7. Brew.

^ while doing these steps today, the portafilter basket fills up evenly initially - indicating that it is not an uneven tamp and that the grinds are distributed well. But there were some dead spots still and small spritz of channelling. However, the taste is pretty good so i guess i shouldn't look too much into this. Of course, looking forward to when there is no channeling in my shots and it should taste even better. Shot time on a home ground roast was 21 seconds with 18g in and 40g out. Will try a darker roast for my next bag of coffee and see if adding WDT into the routine makes the coffee extraction nicer as I wasn't doing it as I watched Matt Perger's videos and he said that tapping is enough and WDT wasn't necessary but after doing it, my shots looked better and will continue doing so.

Some thoughts why there is still spritzing or deadspots:
1. Main suspect. Shot time too fast for the volume you are extracting. Try 18g dose for 18g VST, with 36g out at 30 secs. The flow rate is too fast cos the puck is not giving enough resistance for the rest of your basket to saturate nicely, to create a nice even flow. The water is just going thru the least path of resistance. Solution is to grind finer.
2. are you using 18g vst for the 18 g dose? Depending on the type of coffee you use you will need to dose a bit more or less. lights roasts are denser and hence will take up less volume in your filter basket and hence you will have alot of head space. If you notice your flowrate starts off nice and steady but towards the end it starts going really fast or spritzing it could be because you are using a light roast or the headspace in the filter basket was too much. Towards the end of the shot your puck will start to swell and fills up the head space and you lose too much of the nice resistance that you had when you first started the shot.
3. What beans are you using and how old? I recommend a medium roast or slightly darker roast for a nice looking shot. Try highlander or want something more upmarket go for ona coffee's hitman. the roast is optimised about 7-21 days post roast. The remaining carbon dioxide in fresher roasts that from part of the crema help to make the flow look more even by increasing the viscosity of the shot....There could be dead spots but because the liquid is viscous it will coat the surface area at the bottom of the filter basket nicely before flowing down to your cup.....

4. Is the macap m4 a doser grinder? Try to make sure only the freshly grounded stuff is inside your filter basket. This is super important. old coffee will have poor viscosity. You may want to grind 10g first to push out any old grinds before grinding your actual dose.

The aim if WDT is just to make sure the distribution is as even as possible by fluffing up the grounds as evenly as possible. I use a fine needle stuck to a cork. I agitate the grounds by doing "small circular movements around another larger circular movement around the filter basket" if that makes sense. But you can do what ever you are comfortable with as long as your fluff it up nicely and evenly. Also i don't tap down too hard because i find that it reduces the benefit of making the grounds fluffy in preparation for the tamping. Level Tamping on fluffly grounds will help to make the movement of coffee grounds easier to nicely fill up the basket evenly. Level tamping on grounds tht are already compacted is less beneficial because its harder for the grounds to move arounds to full up the empty spaces to make the puck more homogenous. Leave the grinds as fluffy as possible before you tamp.

Also observe dead spots carefully.... sometimes its not really a dead spot. liquid is still flowing thru but the liquid is very clear especially towards the end of the shot! There could be uneven extraction going on or just that that portion of the puck had already extracted out its solubles much earlier on.

Yes as chinky blink pointed out sometimes the holes are just stuck with insoluble material. Difficult to solve this. its the nature of random particles.

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

Fans of dark roasts, which are your favorites? I normally drink lattes, with long blacks an alternative.

So far Arcaffe Margo is my favorite. Love the very earthy and chocolatey notes. Very forgiving blend too. But I feel it's goes flat fast, which is bad cos the min size is 1kg from FCC. Very competitively priced.

Dutch Colony's dutch and colonial blends are a little too tart and acidic for me. Maybe it's my grinding though.

Homeground's Vanta is pretty good. Bold and creamy. Long blacks work pretty well with it too, with good notes of floral and balanced acidity.

Trying Common Man's blends now.

Coffeeinaplace's beans were one of the best dark roasts I've tried. works really well with level machines. Roasty, caramelised flavours without burnt bitter taste.

I feel dark roasts goes flat faster that lighter roasts.

How's common man's roasts? Its on deliveroo now very convenient.

Toby estate roasts are on the darker side too.

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

After 2 years of deliberation, finally jump the gun and bought my first real espresso machine and also upgrade my grinder. Didn't go for zero retention grinder as I'm not so discerning in taste. I drink milk base 100% of the time.

It's shipping to me now from Italy. Bought from Espresso Coffee Shop. Should receive my next Monday.

Bought these:
Rocket Appartamento Nera
Rocket Faustino

Upgraded from stupid appliance that don't let me do much.
Delonghi Dedica 680
Breville Smart Grinder Pro

hmm i thought the breville was quite a capable grinder.

No problem if you don't have zero retention grinder. just grind a few grams out first to get the best results.

 

[tremor]

Saving up for machine so looking around - for foreign sets, if need servicing, where/how can you get it serviced? That's my only concern as the price is really great!

As good as no warranty. Just pay for servicing lor.

 

[tremor]

hmm i thought the breville was quite a capable grinder.

No problem if you don't have zero retention grinder. just grind a few grams out first to get the best results.

breville smart grinder pro is loud, slow and clumps together leh. But the consistency of the grind is ok. Anyway take the opportunity to upgrade both and make use of consolidated shipping.

 

[Wryer]

Coffeeinaplace's beans were one of the best dark roasts I've tried. works really well with level machines. Roasty, caramelised flavours without burnt bitter taste.

I feel dark roasts goes flat faster that lighter roasts.

How's common man's roasts? Its on deliveroo now very convenient.

Toby estate roasts are on the darker side too.

Will try your recommendation!

I'm trying Common's 22 Martin blend now. Still trying to dial in the optimal grind. Using my default settings on my Sette 30, it's still a little on the sour side. Tried to let my Gaggia warm a little bit more, and seems to help a little. Might try going one fine setting lower tomorrow to try again. Bad thing about Sette 30 is the lack of micro adjustments and it hurts for situations like this.

Btw Commons is having a buy 3 and get 1 free for their 250g beans. $57. Caved in to that even though I know half of them might go stale given my rate of usage (2 double shots a day max.)

 

[Lazy_Tiger]

Will try your recommendation!

I'm trying Common's 22 Martin blend now. Still trying to dial in the optimal grind. Using my default settings on my Sette 30, it's still a little on the sour side. Tried to let my Gaggia warm a little bit more, and seems to help a little. Might try going one fine setting lower tomorrow to try again. Bad thing about Sette 30 is the lack of micro adjustments and it hurts for situations like this.

Btw Commons is having a buy 3 and get 1 free for their 250g beans. $57. Caved in to that even though I know half of them might go stale given my rate of usage (2 double shots a day max.)

Not sure if coffeeinaplace is still in business been a while since I contacted them.

$57 for 1kg is not bad. But yes u right can go stale.

Cafe bond beans are about $55 or less for 1kg. What I did was to separate out the 1kg in several 200g containers and to freeze them. Only defrost what u need.

To defrost I let the beans remain in the air tight container and put It in a dehumidifier just to prevent condensation. Actually if it’s airtight should have much condensation inside the Container. Beans able to last more than a month with this method.

 

[skate87]

As good as no warranty. Just pay for servicing lor.

How much for the machine and shipping includ gst? its a noce looking machine for sure!

 

[tremor]

How much for the machine and shipping includ gst? its a noce looking machine for sure!

Err I bought machine + grinder + knock box + tamping station so machine only I don’t know. U go their website and convert lor. U add to cart can calculate shipping.

 

[turboo]

Hi guys, for those who have experience making chinese style (Ya Kun) kopi, how do I make exactly the same texture/taste using my Mario French Press and 1Zpresso JE Grinder? I tested with 25g Robusta (from Indonesia, tested both medium vs medium-dark roast) + 1 Tbsp condensed milk + 1 Tbsp evaporated milk, steeped for 5 mins but it still tastes very THIN compared to a kopi sui dai from Ya Kun. Don't think the sock is really necessary right?

 

[turboo]

After 2 years of deliberation, finally jump the gun and bought my first real espresso machine and also upgrade my grinder. Didn't go for zero retention grinder as I'm not so discerning in taste. I drink milk base 100% of the time.

It's shipping to me now from Italy. Bought from Espresso Coffee Shop. Should receive my next Monday.

Bought these:
Rocket Appartamento Nera
Rocket Faustino

Upgraded from stupid appliance that don't let me do much.
Delonghi Dedica 680
Breville Smart Grinder Pro

Hello, how much did u pay for shipping? is it direct from them or via a forwarder?

 

[tremor]

Hello, how much did u pay for shipping? is it direct from them or via a forwarder?

Direct from them, shipped via tnt, now tracking still show in Italy, because of Labor Day and weekends, sibei delayed.

185 euro for 49kg stuffs. If u buy less will cost less. Just use the cart and calculate shipping.

 

[turboo]

Direct from them, shipped via tnt, now tracking still show in Italy, because of Labor Day and weekends, sibei delayed.

185 euro for 49kg stuffs. If u buy less will cost less. Just use the cart and calculate shipping.

wow, the shipping sounds super ex. I was also looking for a forwarder from italy to SG last time, but seems that the choices are limited for budget options..

 

[erwinseow]

Hi guys, for those who have experience making chinese style (Ya Kun) kopi, how do I make exactly the same texture/taste using my Mario French Press and 1Zpresso JE Grinder? I tested with 25g Robusta (from Indonesia, tested both medium vs medium-dark roast) + 1 Tbsp condensed milk + 1 Tbsp evaporated milk, steeped for 5 mins but it still tastes very THIN compared to a kopi sui dai from Ya Kun. Don't think the sock is really necessary right?

How much water are u using? Use about 1:10 brew ratio. Grind need to be finer.

 

[DJSalTnuts]

Pulled the trigger today on a Rocket Giotto R - was going to go for the V but they were sold out so I'll go with Rotary. A Specialita and some accessories.

2200 Eur all in with shipping to Singapore. Shipping was about 185 EUR.

Used a discount code to get 120 eur off.