Penrose Sims Villa

[sinequa88]

Dear laojiaos, i have a query about buying penrose as an investment.

A general scenario: I buy a 2BR unit in 2020 at 1 million and hold it for 5 years. Assuming on 2025 the unit appreciates to 1.5 mil and i sell, technically my profit is 500k. I pay back CPF and accrued interest and remain with 300k profit.

Now i look for another condo to invest. But during 2020-2025, the condos assumingly would have appreciate around the same rate. New launches will also be priced higher in 2025 than 2020. Assuming new similar 2BR condo have an average price of 1.5 mil, it will be a nett-nett profit of 0 in the end. (?!)

My girlfriend’s take is that we are only forking out the downpayment and hedging against our bank’s loan interest+CPF accrued interest. Pray that the unit appreciation will also increase steadily.

May i know if this assumption makes sense?

Doesn’t sound right bro, your net profit should be calculated on penrose basis solely, and not confused with your new purchase in 2025. Think there’s some mixup with P&L and cashflow, and even then, when you buy your new condo, you only pay up to the non-financeable portion. You should have some spare cash left.

And I know penrose is cheap, but I don’t think 1m can go up to 1.5m bro hahaha

 

[sgpropertyblog]

Doesn’t sound right bro, your net profit should be calculated on penrose basis solely, and not confused with your new purchase in 2025. Think there’s some mixup with P&L and cashflow, and even then, when you buy your new condo, you only pay up to the non-financeable portion. You should have some spare cash left.

And I know penrose is cheap, but I don’t think 1m can go up to 1.5m bro hahaha

Yea, i agree wif sinequa88.. i seriously dont tink the 2 bedders can reach $1.5M in 5yrs bro.. to be conservative, probably ard $1.2xM still possible, but if u wan $1.5M, probably gotta hold & wait for more than 10yrs ..

And yes, probably the prices for new launch in 2025 most probably will be higher than current pricing, but im sure alot of sifus here will disagree.. as according to them, market will crash, prices will come down.. best is to do your due diligence and your homework..

 

[1993newbie]

$1.5m for penrose in 2025 hmmm.

Even Park Place Residences, located in better locality is only asking $1.2m for 2b1b.

 

[1993newbie]

On side note, park place proper 1 bedder asking from $943 888.

Rental transacted $2400-3000

Hmm wonder 3years from now, will this studio unit hit $950k-1mil mark in resale market? Hmmmmmmm only time will tell

 

[NiShiZhu]

Dear laojiaos, i have a query about buying penrose as an investment.

A general scenario: I buy a 2BR unit in 2020 at 1 million and hold it for 5 years. Assuming on 2025 the unit appreciates to 1.5 mil and i sell, technically my profit is 500k. I pay back CPF and accrued interest and remain with 300k profit.

Now i look for another condo to invest. But during 2020-2025, the condos assumingly would have appreciate around the same rate. New launches will also be priced higher in 2025 than 2020. Assuming new similar 2BR condo have an average price of 1.5 mil, it will be a nett-nett profit of 0 in the end. (?!)

My girlfriend’s take is that we are only forking out the downpayment and hedging against our bank’s loan interest+CPF accrued interest. Pray that the unit appreciation will also increase steadily.

May i know if this assumption makes sense?

Hehe, not all condos are priced sensibly and will appreciate equally over the years.
Some takes decades also can’t breakeven while some managed to see decent gain in short to mid term. It’s all about entry price.
Penrose has all the limelight now because it is priced more sensibly than many other new launches now. Occasionally, u will get to see project like this and if u capitalise at the right entry price, then u r the winner.
That said, I don’t think that location will appreciate until 500k within 5 years. But certainly, SUO owners are screwed

 

[NiShiZhu]

On side note, park place proper 1 bedder asking from $943 888.

Rental transacted $2400-3000

I try to keep quiet about this and u let the cat out of the bag

 

[1993newbie]

Q4 2021, SSD for first batch of PE buyers will be up...
Let’s see how will the studios/1 bedders fair in subsale market. For now will monitor Park Place

I try to keep quiet about this and u let the cat out of the bag

 

[NiShiZhu]

Q4 2021, SSD for first batch of PE buyers will be up...
Let’s see how will the studios/1 bedders fair in subsale market. For now will monitor Park Place

The first phase PPR owners no more SSD. Coz they bought in 2017.
If u scroll in detail, Some PPR units listing asking price are pretty close to PPR 2nd phase launch.
These listing are likely from buyers bought in first phase, 7xx-8xxk.

And I choose to keep quiet about it
Because Some older projects at better location are easily forgotten
Many only focus on new launches.

 

[1993newbie]

PPR > TOP 2020
PE > TOP 2022

Rental already tested for PPR and we can see that PPR being an integrated project, it transact higher as compared to normal condos like SUO & Tre.

D14, 1 bedder past 6 months rental caveats.
Park Place Residences:
1 bed > 2400-3000

Tre Residences:
1 bed > 2200-2450

Sims Urban Oasis:
1 bed > 1800-2500

And I choose to keep quiet about it
Because Some older projects at better location are easily forgotten
Many only focus on new launches.

 

[NiShiZhu]

PPR > TOP 2020
PE > TOP 2022

Rental already tested for PPR and we can see that PPR being an integrated project, it transact higher as compared to normal condos like SUO & Tre.

For this asking price and assuming rental at 2400-3000 range, it translate to 3%-3.8% rental yield.
Hehe, as usual, u are always the party spoiler
Nothing escape your eyes even I choose to keep quiet about it.

 

[Passerboy]

Dear laojiaos, i have a query about buying penrose as an investment.

A general scenario: I buy a 2BR unit in 2020 at 1 million and hold it for 5 years. Assuming on 2025 the unit appreciates to 1.5 mil and i sell, technically my profit is 500k. I pay back CPF and accrued interest and remain with 300k profit.

Now i look for another condo to invest. But during 2020-2025, the condos assumingly would have appreciate around the same rate. New launches will also be priced higher in 2025 than 2020. Assuming new similar 2BR condo have an average price of 1.5 mil, it will be a nett-nett profit of 0 in the end. (?!)

My girlfriend’s take is that we are only forking out the downpayment and hedging against our bank’s loan interest+CPF accrued interest. Pray that the unit appreciation will also increase steadily.

May i know if this assumption makes sense?

I don’t think a 2bed1bath at Penrose if u purchase for 1m can exit at 1.5m in 2025, the same unit size at Park Place Residences are asking between 1.2-1.4m but none are getting buying yet, Parc Esta 2bed1bath is about 1-1.1m (considerably better location and finishing).

Would think a better guide price is 1.2m-1.25m for Penrose by 2025z

 

[drkcynic]

For this asking price and assuming rental at 2400-3000 range, it translate to 3%-3.8% rental yield.
Hehe, as usual, u are always the party spoiler
Nothing escape your eyes even I choose to keep quiet about it.

He is the 1 bedder expert wor.

I think I will drop PR, all things considered.

Good luck to guys going for the launch.

 

[ggdotcom]

Thank you shifus for advising. Now just waiting for SF viewing and balloting if oversub. Atares will be our backup plan as we are betting on Nexus International School for future selling/renting opportunities.

 

[NiShiZhu]

He is the 1 bedder expert wor.

I think I will drop PR, all things considered.

Good luck to guys going for the launch.

Afterall, PPR will still lead the pack in terms of rental and resales in D14. If PPR sux in both, the rest are not spared either. Then the next dimension to look at is entry price Liao. Who enter lower plays an impt part in rental yield and cap gain.

I felt PR can still consider given its Low psf and entry price.
But to stay there I’m not too sure

 

[NiShiZhu]

I don’t think a 2bed1bath at Penrose if u purchase for 1m can exit at 1.5m in 2025, the same unit size at Park Place Residences are asking between 1.2-1.4m but none are getting buying yet, Parc Esta 2bed1bath is about 1-1.1m (considerably better location and finishing).

Would think a better guide price is 1.2m-1.25m for Penrose by 2025z

On conservative side, 1.1xmil thereabout in 2025

 

[Passerboy]

Afterall, PPR will still lead the pack in terms of rental and resales in D14. If PPR sux in both, the rest are not spared either. Then the next dimension to look at is entry price Liao. Who enter lower plays an impt part in rental yield and cap gain.

I felt PR can still consider given its Low psf and entry price.
But to stay there I’m not too sure

Yup Park Place Residences is the leader in terms of D14 potential, if it doesn’t take off, the rest also don’t need think far haha.. cos PPR is at the heart of PLB and it’s an integrated development with quality finishing.

 

[homechaser]

Why ppl so hesitant abt staying in penrose area haha.. making me think twice now. My thinking is if geylang core i def wont stay. But that outskirt of geylang is ok? Far away enough from the geylang activity but yet near enough to enjoy the convenience

Afterall, PPR will still lead the pack in terms of rental and resales in D14. If PPR sux in both, the rest are not spared either. Then the next dimension to look at is entry price Liao. Who enter lower plays an impt part in rental yield and cap gain.

I felt PR can still consider given its Low psf and entry price.
But to stay there I’m not too sure

 

[drkcynic]

100-150k within 4 years is pretty decent imo, let us compare this to Eight Riversuites (RCR relatively same walking distance to MRT as SUO) and the most outstanding proj High Park Residences (just taking transactions from the past 6 months as I am a non premium subscriber).

Eight Riversuite (purchased in 2012-2013 sold in 2020)
8 positive resale transactions ranging $8-$124k v 1 unprofitable transaction $111k loss

Sims Urban Oasis (purchased in 2015 sold in 2020)
15 profitable resale transactions ranging $59-142k

High Park Residences (purchased in 2015 sold in 2020)
26 profitable resale transactions ranging $111-$255k

SUO resale transactions are actually decent, cos no losses and then decent gains I would say, since property dabbles uses leverage. Eight Riversuites is actually already 8 years old though.

I guess it depends on perspectives. 59k-142k gross is not "very healthy profits" to me over 5 years. Add to the fact that it has the cloud of having only sold 4% hanging over it, I could probably be better off doing a rental play during this time.

To me, an adult has maybe 20-25 years to invest in and flip properties before the age thing start kicking in. Our time is limited and the profile of properties I am aiming for needs to have a high probability to return me a minimum of 150k NETT over 5 years, or else it's really not worth my time or the risk I am taking.

Just my opinion.

 

[drkcynic]

On conservative side, 1.1xmil thereabout in 2025

If he can find a buyer that is.

 

[isometric]

1 bedroom from 788,000 (1665 psf)
2 bedroom from 943,000 ( 1462 psf)
3 bedroom from 1,326,000 (1416 psf)
4 bedroom from 2,111,000 (1520psf)


understand this is from the developer officially..
surprisingly low!

At this Penrose pricing of 14xx-15xxpsf, does it mean those who buy Parc Esta at 16xxpsf is stuck? PE has more than >1000 units.. so assume 50% did not buy during launch at 15xxpsf, then at least 500 owners now stuck with PE with low chance of appreciation?

I mean if a resale buyer were to buy into D14 in the future, Penrose will likely be the 2nd project they look into ( after PPR) cause not only cheapest (cause 1st owner can let go at 16xxpsf and still earn decent profits), nearer to city centre, and less cramped as well. Whatever PE has, PR has even better!

PE will be the 3rd choice to look at after PPR and PR

Make sense?