Proposal Ring - Part 2

[Lurker_13]

Congrats on your purchase Jarrytrump, do post some pics of the ring when you received it.

 

[ellenne_g]

I have a leehwa destinee voucher sgd200 off of purchase. Will not use. Willing to sell for only 120.

 

[EricMagnusLensherr]

I think after 2 years, you are really getting out of touch. Make a trip down to Jannpaul to see a comparison of their super ideal to normal diamonds. Then you will really see what is visible to the eye and what is not. Static pictures do not tell the full story.

It is the cold hard truth that a super ideal G 0.8 carat will look bigger or same size and much more dazzling as compared to a 1 carat D with good cut. For obvious reason, the 0.8 is going to cost more as well. So even without looking at the cert or voicing out their specs, the eye could tell it all.
Never comprise cut.

Lastly, I want to agree with one sentence of yours. Girls do look at carats first. However, once they compare side by side, the one with the superior cuts wins hand down. (the girl with the bigger diamond may even wonder if the sales assistant had scammed her) LoL!

Hahaha, seems abit general leh. Can compromise cut, but up to what point only. Have to balance all the Cs. In his case, Size/weight is important. He is probably comparing Super Ideal with 3X ba. You compare with gia good abit extreme, thats like the bottom 20-30%. 3X as long as depth not toooooo off, even 62 to about 63, the 0.8 has no way of looking bigger then a 1ct. 0.8 about 6mm max, 1ct about 6.5mm, 0.5mm is pretty big and visible to the human eyes.


Dazzling, again, depends on what you are talking about. White light return or scintillation. A normal 3x in coffee shop lighting, again, assuming its not some messed up CA/PA combo, can look fine. If talking about pure brightness, a CA/PA combo towards brilliant ideal cut, which is not the standard "Super Ideal" cut, can actually be brighter, and depends on personal preference. People can argue about lose of scintillation and fire etc, but that simply depends on personal preference. The current "super ideal" just attempts to balance both and might not be what a person prefers. To put it simply, its a safe bet and equally fiery and brilliant. Some people might prefer more brilliance (White light), others might prefer more fire (Color Light), there are always sacrifices when choosing one or the other.

Also, take the viewing conditions, rather then examining critically, tilting the stones/rings, multiple viewing conditions etc. Lets be realistic, in most cases the girls might just put beside each other compare in 3 - 5 seconds and "Haha ! Mine bigger/brighter/Whiter !" thats about it. Explaining scintillation, fire, balance etc, and giving them lessons might not always be possible.

My advise is this, plan your diamond. Know what your other half likes, prefers and prioritizes, assign different weights to each aspect of the 4c and more to what she feels is important. Know what to sacrifice and how much. Other then the magical C color, which he might just be rusty, I think XsenseX did the correct thing, i doubt he will compromise cut all the way down to GIA good cut just for size. Less important doesn't mean not important, Lower priority does not mean low priority, its all relative. Don't be too fixated by cut. While it'll still be a damn good stone, in the end, as cut grading changes, your super ideal might not always be a super ideal, even JP's super ideal. Have to learn when to be flexible, about what and how much when choosing your diamond.

 

[lancelotalbion]

Hi All,

I'm a newbie here..
I am looking for engagement ring and stumbled upon this thread.

Seems like a lot of good review on JannPaul.. I'm planning to drop by soon.
but can anyone help to enlighten me on JannPaul's Super Ideal Cut vs Solasfera?
Which one is the better diamond, assuming the 4Cs are similar between the 2?
Also, any idea on the price difference when comparing the diamond of similar spec?

Thanks a lot!!

cheers

 

[EricMagnusLensherr]

Hi All,

I'm a newbie here..
I am looking for engagement ring ande stumbled upon this thread.

Seems like a lot of good review on JannPaul.. I'm planning to drop by soon.
but can anyone help to enlighten me on JannPaul's Super Ideal Cut vs Solasfera?
Which one is the better diamond, assuming the 4Cs are similar between the 2?
Also, any idea on the price difference when comparing the diamond of similar spec?

Thanks a lot!!

cheers

Please note that some of the following is my opinion only and others may or may not agree. First of all, it is difficult compare directly as the Jann Paul super ideal is a traditional 57 but round facet while the solasfera is a modified round cut. As such, normal grading labs like gia does not grade the cut of the solasfera.

I can almost garuntee that most stones by JP, be it their super ideal or their solasfera of which they are the sole Singapore distributor, Are cut to extremely high standards, and chances are you won't go wrong with either. Which you prefer depends on what you would like. The solasfera, due to additional facets, produce a larger number of smaller flashes, while the super ideal produces a smaller number of larger flashes. This is an extremely different characteristic, and it depends on your preference. Additional features of the solasfera is close to 100% light return (contrary to what some customer were informed, it is NOT 100%, but it's damned close and among the highest)And its 10 hearts and arrows rather then the traditional 8.

Here comes my opinions. In videos by jp, the solasfera looks much better to me. But upon visiting the shop, I find that this is not always true. For me, it would seem like for smaller sizes, below 0.7ct, the smaller flashes of the solasfera, makes it look worse to me. In this case, I would prefer a normal 57 facet. Larger then this,esp 1ct and above, the smaller but increased number of flashes looks better to me. This is especially true once you hit the 2ct range. To me, this difference between video and real life is probably because for smaller sizes, the video is not an accurate representation of the viewing condition. The video is extremely magnified compared to viewing a smaller stone in real life and what looks good when large might not look good when small. Another reason is that human eyes perceive light differently from a camera, and if the flashes are too small, the human eyes might not be able so resolve it. once again, this is my personal opinion and preference, and every one is different.

Pricewise, expect to pay about 20 to 30% more for a solasfera due to the brand. That said, don't expect to easily find an exact comparison, as the solasfera stock is relatively limited.

 

[spLeenfuL]

IMO comparing size instead of cut can depend on the group of girls. For example, I think salesgirl/ah lian type would compare size but media/business studies kind would compare cut. The sophisticate will definitely pick cut.

I think if someone shows me her larger but poorly cut cushion diamond, I'd just tell her mine's a brellia & that brellias are among the most well cut, & that poorly cut large diamonds can go for as little as 10% of the price of a triple E. =P



Hmm, not among my circle of friends but probably girls around my age group will (early 20s) as most bfs will only get them Taka or SK (no offense to anyone who got their diamonds there). Maybe girls who don't know anything, just like girls who go for size instead of cut. LOL Or perhaps the appearance-focused who think brand is everything. IMO the rock speaks for itself with most people.

Lucky my gf not ah lian type. lol.

Proposed to my gf yesterday which was our anniversary date. I did it a restaurant that we went to on our first date.. I'm not a public person and crowd shy.. but this restaurant has some meaning to us and I know she is the extrovert type.. so should be fine with public proposal. I reserved a secluded table somewhere in the corner, so it won't attract too much attention

The ring came out during the dessert course.. had to order a few glasses to boost up.. haha. When she saw the ring, she was very surprised and started tearing with happiness... and of course, she said YES!!

When I tried to put the ring on her finger, I was too kan chiong and the ring slipped!! It fell to the floor... Super PAI SEH....... I faster pick up the ring and put on her finger.. the rest was history... and I know she's gonna tell this to the rest of her friends.....

Just need to bring the ring back to JP to resize.. Now must hunt for wedding bands...

 

[Hellooo]

Hi All,

I'm a newbie here..
I am looking for engagement ring and stumbled upon this thread.

Seems like a lot of good review on JannPaul.. I'm planning to drop by soon.
but can anyone help to enlighten me on JannPaul's Super Ideal Cut vs Solasfera?
Which one is the better diamond, assuming the 4Cs are similar between the 2?
Also, any idea on the price difference when comparing the diamond of similar spec?

Thanks a lot!!

cheers

Better u fix an appt with them and decide after their education.. u can let them noe ur budget and preferences so they can get ready the diamonds when u go down.. my bf and i went down tgt and we both prefer the Solasfera due to the many smaller sparkles.. Solasfera is more expensive, but we didnt compare the price between both with similar specs.. good luck in ur diamond purchase and rem to share aft tt..

 

[hollander]

Lucky my gf not ah lian type. lol.

Proposed to my gf yesterday which was our anniversary date. I did it a restaurant that we went to on our first date.. I'm not a public person and crowd shy.. but this restaurant has some meaning to us and I know she is the extrovert type.. so should be fine with public proposal. I reserved a secluded table somewhere in the corner, so it won't attract too much attention

The ring came out during the dessert course.. had to order a few glasses to boost up.. haha. When she saw the ring, she was very surprised and started tearing with happiness... and of course, she said YES!!

When I tried to put the ring on her finger, I was too kan chiong and the ring slipped!! It fell to the floor... Super PAI SEH....... I faster pick up the ring and put on her finger.. the rest was history... and I know she's gonna tell this to the rest of her friends.....

Just need to bring the ring back to JP to resize.. Now must hunt for wedding bands...

Congrats Bro on your proposal!!!!

 

[Lurker_13]

Congrats to U bro!

 

[lancelotalbion]

Please note that some of the following is my opinion only and others may or may not agree. First of all, it is difficult compare directly as the Jann Paul super ideal is a traditional 57 but round facet while the solasfera is a modified round cut. As such, normal grading labs like gia does not grade the cut of the solasfera.

I can almost garuntee that most stones by JP, be it their super ideal or their solasfera of which they are the sole Singapore distributor, Are cut to extremely high standards, and chances are you won't go wrong with either. Which you prefer depends on what you would like. The solasfera, due to additional facets, produce a larger number of smaller flashes, while the super ideal produces a smaller number of larger flashes. This is an extremely different characteristic, and it depends on your preference. Additional features of the solasfera is close to 100% light return (contrary to what some customer were informed, it is NOT 100%, but it's damned close and among the highest)And its 10 hearts and arrows rather then the traditional 8.

Here comes my opinions. In videos by jp, the solasfera looks much better to me. But upon visiting the shop, I find that this is not always true. For me, it would seem like for smaller sizes, below 0.7ct, the smaller flashes of the solasfera, makes it look worse to me. In this case, I would prefer a normal 57 facet. Larger then this,esp 1ct and above, the smaller but increased number of flashes looks better to me. This is especially true once you hit the 2ct range. To me, this difference between video and real life is probably because for smaller sizes, the video is not an accurate representation of the viewing condition. The video is extremely magnified compared to viewing a smaller stone in real life and what looks good when large might not look good when small. Another reason is that human eyes perceive light differently from a camera, and if the flashes are too small, the human eyes might not be able so resolve it. once again, this is my personal opinion and preference, and every one is different.

Pricewise, expect to pay about 20 to 30% more for a solasfera due to the brand. That said, don't expect to easily find an exact comparison, as the solasfera stock is relatively limited.

Thanks, Eric for sharing your opinion! Appreciate it a lot!

Better u fix an appt with them and decide after their education.. u can let them noe ur budget and preferences so they can get ready the diamonds when u go down.. my bf and i went down tgt and we both prefer the Solasfera due to the many smaller sparkles.. Solasfera is more expensive, but we didnt compare the price between both with similar specs.. good luck in ur diamond purchase and rem to share aft tt..

I'm having an appointment with JannPaul this coming Sat so I'll see how the 2 types compare against each other!

On a side note, I visited other shop today and was told that diamonds with AGS certification have better cut than those with GIA certification. And the guy did show me the GIA cert and AGS cert diamonds side by side. Both diamonds are certified triple Ex (for GIA) and triple 0 (for AGS) and it does look like the AGS diamond shows more sparkle and looks better than the GIA. Also he mentioned that for diamonds with better cut, they will definitely go to AGS for certification rather than GIA. Not too sure how true the statement is....
Anyone can share the insight on this?

 

[crunsik]

Hi all,

Has anyone here bought Larry's Lazare diamond? Don't see anyone mentioning it here. Is it worth the cost to get it? Thanks for the help!

 

[EricMagnusLensherr]

Lucky my gf not ah lian type. lol.

Proposed to my gf yesterday which was our anniversary date. I did it a restaurant that we went to on our first date.. I'm not a public person and crowd shy.. but this restaurant has some meaning to us and I know she is the extrovert type.. so should be fine with public proposal. I reserved a secluded table somewhere in the corner, so it won't attract too much attention

The ring came out during the dessert course.. had to order a few glasses to boost up.. haha. When she saw the ring, she was very surprised and started tearing with happiness... and of course, she said YES!!

When I tried to put the ring on her finger, I was too kan chiong and the ring slipped!! It fell to the floor... Super PAI SEH....... I faster pick up the ring and put on her finger.. the rest was history... and I know she's gonna tell this to the rest of her friends.....

Just need to bring the ring back to JP to resize.. Now must hunt for wedding bands...

Congratulations bro !
JP also does wedding ring so can ask them if you still don't mind continuing with them

 

[Kiatty]

Hey guys! after reading through the many pages of this thread, has really been very useful and finally went down to JP to deposit my proposal diamond. Still very noob even after going thru the JP course. Please feel free to give your thoughts on this piece that i selected. Cheers~

 

[EricMagnusLensherr]

I'm having an appointment with JannPaul this coming Sat so I'll see how the 2 types compareagainst each other!

If interested, you can ask jp to help you do a blind test in which they prepare 2 similar stones but don't tell you which stone is which stone, you just choose whichever you feel looks better. Once you have chosen, they then let you know which stone is which. Its a very good way me determining which type you prefer.

On a side note, I visited other shop today and was told that diamonds with AGS certification have better cut than those with GIA certification. And the guy did show me the GIA cert and AGS cert diamonds side by side. Both diamonds are certified triple Ex (for GIA) and triple 0 (for AGS) and it does look like the AGS diamond shows more sparkle and looks better than the GIA. Also he mentioned that for diamonds with better cut, they will definitely go to AGS for certification rather than GIA. Not too sure how true the statement is....
Anyone can share the insight on this?

With regards to the cert, unfortunately I have no idea how they determine which stone goes to ags and which goes to gia. It is true that the ags criteria is more strict and thus achieving ags 000 is significantly more difficult the achieving a gia xxx. But gia is one of the most if not the most established grading labs in the world and they grade a significant portions of the world's diamonds. Because of this, even if due to their looser cut grading standards, 70% of their xxx's is not as good ags 000, the remaining 30% of equivalent stones is still a significant number and probably more then the number of ags 000's as ags is a relatively small lab.

If you are choosing yourself and know nuts about diamonds, selecting an ags 000 would probably be safer then a gia xxx. But if experts like JP are selecting for you, there would probably be no different between a gia and ags cert.

As mentioned, GIA excellent has a wide range and it is possible that they compared a gia xxx at the lower end of the excellent range vs a ags 000 stone. But stores tend to do this kind of "trick". In all fairness, they are not lying. For example, when i visited Charlotte, a highend boutiques, they also did similar on the spot comparisons, as well as printed material showing simulated dispersion. But when asked, they did honestly reply that no, the comparison was done with a normal GIA XXX and not a Gia XXX with proportions closer to ideal, so kudos to them for knowing the difference and being honest about it.

Another example, lets take the JP videos, in most videos, they usually just say this is our Super Ideal, this is a GIA XXX etc. They do NOT document the actual proportions and as such could have selected a XXX at the lower end of the excellent range to do the comparison. Please note that this IS a fair comparison as the majority of the customers do not read up may just assume all gia xxx are the same and equally good, and may enough grab a stone like the GIA XXX they compared with.

Not sure which store showed you the ags and gia stone, but if it was Lee Hwa, the only chain B&M i know licensed to market the ags brand in SG (the rest who carry ags are mainly private jewellers, if there is another chain carrying AGS, please let me know), then Lee Hwa was comparing their signature cut, a super ideal or at worse ideal cut level stone to a normal/low end of excellent gia xxx.

(Please note that some of the information here is simplified and summarized for the sake of brevity and because my posts already tend to be long enough as they are)

 

[lancelotalbion]

At

If interested, you can ask jp to help you do a blind test in which they prepare 2 similar stones but don't tell you which stone is which stone, you just choose whichever you feel looks better. Once you have chosen, they then let you know which stone is which. Its a very good way me determining which type you prefer.

With regards to the cert, unfortunately I have no idea how they determine which stone goes to ags and which goes to gia. It is true that the ags criteria is more strict and thus achieving ags 000 is significantly more difficult the achieving a gia xxx. But gia is one of the most if not the most established grading labs in the world and they grade a significant portions me the world's diamonds. Because of this, even if due to their looser cut grading standards, 70% of their xxx's is not as good ags 000, the remaining 30% of equivalent stones is still a significant number and probably more then the number of ags 000's as ags is a relatively small lab.

If you are choosing yourself and know nuts about diamonds, selecting an ags 000 would probably be safer then a gia xxx. But if experts like JP are selecting for you, there would probably be no different between a gia and ags cert.

As mentioned, GIA excellent has a wide range and it is possible that they compared a gia xxx at the lower end of the excellent range vs a ags 000 stone. But stores tend to do this kind of "trick". In all fairness, they are not lying. For example, when i visited Charlotte, a highend boutiques, they also did similar on the spot comparisons, as well as printed material showing simulated dispersion. But when asked, they did honestly reply that no, the comparison was done with a normal GIA XXX and not a Gia XXX with proportions closer to ideal, so kudos to them. Another example, lets take the JP videos, in most videos, they usually just say this is our Super Ideal, this is a GIA XXX etc. They do NOT document the actual proportions and as such could have simply selected a XXX at the lower end of the excellent range to do the comparison.

Not sure which store showed you the ags and gia stone, but if it was Lee Hwa, the only chain B&M i know licensed to market the ags brand in SG (the rest who carry ags are mainly private jewellers, if there is another chain carrying AGS, please let me know), then Lee Hwa was comparing their signature cut, a super ideal or at worse ideal cut level stone to a normal/low end of excellent gia xxx.

(Please note that some of the information here is simplified and summarized for the sake of brevity and because my posts already tend to be long enough as they are)

Yeah, the store which show me the AGS/GIA comparison is indeed a private jewellers. To be fair I did not enquire further into details on what kind of GIA XXX which he used for the comparison purpose..

Today I'm planning to drop by Canary Diamond. Anyone has experience buying diamonds from them? From other forums and blogs, it looks like Canary also has a lot of good reviews, and some did say that their price is relatively cheaper than JP..

 

[zeally]

At

If interested, you can ask jp to help you do a blind test in which they prepare 2 similar stones but don't tell you which stone is which stone, you just choose whichever you feel looks better. Once you have chosen, they then let you know which stone is which. Its a very good way me determining which type you prefer.

With regards to the cert, unfortunately I have no idea how they determine which stone goes to ags and which goes to gia. It is true that the ags criteria is more strict and thus achieving ags 000 is significantly more difficult the achieving a gia xxx. But gia is one of the most if not the most established grading labs in the world and they grade a significant portions me the world's diamonds. Because of this, even if due to their looser cut grading standards, 70% of their xxx's is not as good ags 000, the remaining 30% of equivalent stones is still a significant number and probably more then the number of ags 000's as ags is a relatively small lab.

If you are choosing yourself and know nuts about diamonds, selecting an ags 000 would probably be safer then a gia xxx. But if experts like JP are selecting for you, there would probably be no different between a gia and ags cert.

As mentioned, GIA excellent has a wide range and it is possible that they compared a gia xxx at the lower end of the excellent range vs a ags 000 stone. But stores tend to do this kind of "trick". In all fairness, they are not lying. For example, when i visited Charlotte, a highend boutiques, they also did similar on the spot comparisons, as well as printed material showing simulated dispersion. But when asked, they did honestly reply that no, the comparison was done with a normal GIA XXX and not a Gia XXX with proportions closer to ideal, so kudos to them. Another example, lets take the JP videos, in most videos, they usually just say this is our Super Ideal, this is a GIA XXX etc. They do NOT document the actual proportions and as such could have simply selected a XXX at the lower end of the excellent range to do the comparison.

Not sure which store showed you the ags and gia stone, but if it was Lee Hwa, the only chain B&M i know licensed to market the ags brand in SG (the rest who carry ags are mainly private jewellers, if there is another chain carrying AGS, please let me know), then Lee Hwa was comparing their signature cut, a super ideal or at worse ideal cut level stone to a normal/low end of excellent gia xxx.

(Please note that some of the information here is simplified and summarized for the sake of brevity and because my posts already tend to be long enough as they are)

There is another difference between GIA and AGSL.
AGSL uses technology and light returns to grade their diamond, but GIA uses stone to stone comparison to decide on the diamond cut grade.

The significance of this is that while some GIA triple ex may not shine that well as their proportions are not as good, they are generally bright when viewed from most angles due the method used by GIA (using humans eyes as the criteria) while the method used by AGSL (as well as people who uses ASET and Idealscope) will lead to very beautiful and vibrant stones from commonly viewed angles, one of which is the diamond in its face up position.

 

[zeally]

Hahaha, seems abit general leh. Can compromise cut, but up to what point only. Have to balance all the Cs. In his case, Size/weight is important. He is probably comparing Super Ideal with 3X ba. You compare with gia good abit extreme, thats like the bottom 20-30%. 3X as long as depth not toooooo off, even 62 to about 63, the 0.8 has no way of looking bigger then a 1ct. 0.8 about 6mm max, 1ct about 6.5mm, 0.5mm is pretty big and visible to the human eyes.


Dazzling, again, depends on what you are talking about. White light return or scintillation. A normal 3x in coffee shop lighting, again, assuming its not some messed up CA/PA combo, can look fine. If talking about pure brightness, a CA/PA combo towards brilliant ideal cut, which is not the standard "Super Ideal" cut, can actually be brighter, and depends on personal preference. People can argue about lose of scintillation and fire etc, but that simply depends on personal preference. The current "super ideal" just attempts to balance both and might not be what a person prefers. To put it simply, its a safe bet and equally fiery and brilliant. Some people might prefer more brilliance (White light), others might prefer more fire (Color Light), there are always sacrifices when choosing one or the other.

Also, take the viewing conditions, rather then examining critically, tilting the stones/rings, multiple viewing conditions etc. Lets be realistic, in most cases the girls might just put beside each other compare in 3 - 5 seconds and "Haha ! Mine bigger/brighter/Whiter !" thats about it. Explaining scintillation, fire, balance etc, and giving them lessons might not always be possible.

My advise is this, plan your diamond. Know what your other half likes, prefers and prioritizes, assign different weights to each aspect of the 4c and more to what she feels is important. Know what to sacrifice and how much. Other then the magical C color, which he might just be rusty, I think XsenseX did the correct thing, i doubt he will compromise cut all the way down to GIA good cut just for size. Less important doesn't mean not important, Lower priority does not mean low priority, its all relative. Don't be too fixated by cut. While it'll still be a damn good stone, in the end, as cut grading changes, your super ideal might not always be a super ideal, even JP's super ideal. Have to learn when to be flexible, about what and how much when choosing your diamond.

I agree with you that a 0.8 is around 6mm while 1 carat is around 6.5mm with some minor differences due to diamond depth.

However, please note that you do not have a vernier calipers now. All you have is your eyes. Imagine the center a diamond is very bright and the sides are rather bright too, compared with another diamond whose center is less bright but the sides are dull. This difference in lighting effect will cause you to have a misconception in size. In a super exaggerated analogy (warning, this is the most extreme case which is not likely in real life), how much bigger is it when you try to estimate the size of a lighted bulb compared to it when it is off.

If you google on the web you should be able to find a JP video which shows how a 0.9 super ideal is same size as a 1 carat GIA common triple ex.

 

[spLeenfuL]

Congrats to U bro!

Congrats Bro on your proposal!!!!

Congratulations bro !
JP also does wedding ring so can ask them if you still don't mind continuing with them

Thanks guys!

 

[spLeenfuL]

Hey guys! after reading through the many pages of this thread, has really been very useful and finally went down to JP to deposit my proposal diamond. Still very noob even after going thru the JP course. Please feel free to give your thoughts on this piece that i selected. Cheers~

GXGX! After reading this thread, I'm sure we all have more knowledge that SAs already

I see a few dots at the hearts that looks like the inclusions. Is the diamond eye clean? Most VS2s are eye clean anyway.. so it should be safe

 

[spLeenfuL]

Hi all,

Has anyone here bought Larry's Lazare diamond? Don't see anyone mentioning it here. Is it worth the cost to get it? Thanks for the help!

Lazare is an ideal cut diamond. It's abit too pricey for an ideal cut. If you're into Lazare, Hong Kong should have a bigger selection.. it's a Hong Kong brand.. (I might be wrong though)