New 10Gbps/5Gbps/6Gbps/3Gbps XGS-PON based plans

[Groudon]

It’s not about whether the speed is fast or not. It’s about false marketing… they cannot advertised 10Gbps but provide equipment that doesn’t provide the full bandwidth…

If it’s in the states, they would have been sued.

Well, in the States, AT&T provides XGSPON in many locations as well (albeit up to 5Gbit/s at the moment).

The technology does technically support a maximum line rate down/up of 9.953Gbit/s, and after the framing overhead, and accounting for usage across other users on the same PON port, you won't really be seeing speeds anywhere close to 9 Gbit/s.

This is wildly different compared to GPON, because remember GPON supports 2.4G down, but I guarantee you in residential usage, PON port usage is really low and can therefore accommodate the bursts from different users every once in a while. The same isn't true once you move up to XGSPON as all bandwidth available on the PON port is shared across minimally (I presume) at least a 1:64 split ratio on most providers.

 

[Mach3.2]

at least a 1:64 split ratio on most providers

I'm not sure if they can get netlink trust to give them a different split ratio, but I do remember reading documents online mentioning netlink trust will provision either a 1:1 or 1:24 split ratio link from central office to building.

As i understand, the splitter is in the building's MDF room (page 9) so they could very well have a different split ratio for XGS-PON, because I think 1:24 split will make the service a lot less profitable to operate...

Some infograph showing an overview of the infrastructure
https://www.imda.gov.sg/-/media/imd...090225_provisionservngnbn/diagrams_s1to11.pdf

 

[Henry Ng]

Well, in the States, AT&T provides XGSPON in many locations as well (albeit up to 5Gbit/s at the moment).

The technology does technically support a maximum line rate down/up of 9.953Gbit/s, and after the framing overhead, and accounting for usage across other users on the same PON port, you won't really be seeing speeds anywhere close to 9 Gbit/s.

This is wildly different compared to GPON, because remember GPON supports 2.4G down, but I guarantee you in residential usage, PON port usage is really low and can therefore accommodate the bursts from different users every once in a while. The same isn't true once you move up to XGSPON as all bandwidth available on the PON port is shared across minimally (I presume) at least a 1:64 split ratio on most providers.

Starhub is using what? 1:64?

 

[sglandscape]

Starhub is using what? 1:64?

Split ratio likely 1:24

 

[stephenbishop]

Split ratio likely 1:24

Curious how a 1:24 split ratio works for landed residential premise
given that the splitter is located in the building mdf room and there is no such room or splitter in a landed residential premise. Is it therefore 1:1 for landed residential premise? Any ideas/guesses?

 

[Apparatus]

So today starhub came this morning and setup my 10gbps tp-link EB801v routers x2 mesh.

Towards the evening i thought of logging to the router and manage devices and perform parental controls, but "admin" or "password" didn't work at 192.168.0.1 the router admin login page.

I Called 1633 twice and the CSO don't understand what's router admin password and told me to ask TP link vendor.

I talked to two TP link live agents and they told me to get from starhub.

Does anyone get the device router password of EB801v of starhu

Check the sticker on the router. Likely to be stated there as it's the default. How about the manual?

Is there an option to say you forget your password? If yes just answer yes and input your email. It'll send a new password to the email

 

[xiaofan]

I'm not sure if they can get netlink trust to give them a different split ratio, but I do remember reading documents online mentioning netlink trust will provision either a 1:1 or 1:24 split ratio link from central office to building.

As i understand, the splitter is in the building's MDF room (page 9) so they could very well have a different split ratio for XGS-PON, because I think 1:24 split will make the service a lot less profitable to operate...

Some infograph showing an overview of the infrastructure
https://www.imda.gov.sg/-/media/imd...090225_provisionservngnbn/diagrams_s1to11.pdf

Nice info.

As per the following article, "XGS-PON supports up to a 1:128 split ratio in the ODN, as well as 1:64, 1:32 and 1:16 split ratios."
https://broadbandlibrary.com/10-gbps-symmetrical-with-xgs-pon

From the following discussion, it seems to me 1:32 or 1:64 may well be the norm for Singapore ISPs. 1:16 is probably not economical for the ISP and 1:128 is probably not desired as well.

 

[xiaofan]

Curious how a 1:24 split ratio works for landed residential premise
given that the splitter is located in the building mdf room and there is no such room or splitter in a landed residential premise. Is it therefore 1:1 for landed residential premise? Any ideas/guesses?

I think there will be a "room" or junction box nearby. This is probably why NLT charges higher for the landed residential premise as they need to pull longer Fibre to the premise.
https://www.netlinktrust.com/fibre-network/fibre-network-for-homes

So the split ratio will likely be the same as HDB / Private High Rise Apartments. And I guess it will be 1:32 or 1:64.

 

[stephenbishop]

I think there will be a "room" or junction box nearby. This is probably why NLT charges higher for the landed residential premise as they need to pull longer Fibre to the premise.
https://www.netlinktrust.com/fibre-network/fibre-network-for-homes

So the split ratio will likely be the same as HDB / Private High Rise Apartments. And I guess it will be 1:32 or 1:64.

Logical and you are probably right....

Found this schematic on the NLT website which seems to suggest the same. The chain is from NLT CO to an FDP in an MDF room in high rise residential premises and from there to FTPs in apartments or, for landed residential premises, from FDPs in the ducts to FTP in the landed premises.

 

[Nashstruck]

Is it not on the box?

So today starhub came this morning and setup my 10gbps tp-link EB801v routers x2 mesh.

Towards the evening i thought of logging to the router and manage devices and perform parental controls, but "admin" or "password" didn't work at 192.168.0.1 the router admin login page.

I Called 1633 twice and the CSO don't understand what's router admin password and told me to ask TP link vendor.

I talked to two TP link live agents and they told me to get from starhub.

Does anyone get the device router password of EB801v of starhub?

 

[xiaofan]

According to the EB810v link,

• VoIP Calls: Supports multiple VoIP accounts and various call features to surpass traditional landlines.

it does support 2x FXS ports -- What do the Terms FXS and FXO mean?

I guess the v in EB810v indicate it support VoIP.
https://static.tp-link.com/upload/product-overview/2023/202308/20230810/EB810v Datasheet.pdf

As to whether we actually connect the analog phone to the FXS RJ11 port, only when user actually receive can tell. I don't need land line so didn't bother.

TP-Link has removed the PDF file.

Simply base on the public specs:

EB810v
https://www.tp-link.com/sg/service-provider/wifi-router/eb810v/

1. BE22000 Tri-Band WiFi: 11520 Mbps (6 GHz, HE320) + 8640 Mbps (5 GHz, HE240) + 1376 Mbps (2.4 GHz).
2. 10G Fiber and Ethernet Internet Connections: 1× 10GE/SFP+ Combo WAN port, 1× 10GE LAN port, and 3× 2.5GE LAN ports

Archer BE805
https://www.tp-link.com/us/home-networking/wifi-router/archer-be805/

1. BE19000 Tri-Band WiFi: 11520 Mbps (6 GHz:, HE320) + 5760 Mbps (5 GHz, HE160) + 1376 Mbps (2.4 GHz)
2. Dual 10 G Ports: 1× 10 Gbps WAN port + 1× 10 Gbps LAN port + 4× 1 Gbps LAN ports + 2× USB 3.0 ports,

HB810
https://www.tp-link.com/sg/service-provider/wifi-router/hb810/

1. BE22000 Tri-Band WiFi: 11520 Mbps (6 GHz, HE320) + 8640 Mbps (5 GHz, HE240) + 1376 Mbps (2.4 GHz)
2. 10G Internet Connections: 1× 10GE/SFP+ Combo WAN port, 1× 10GE LAN port, and 2× 2.5GE LAN ports

Assuming the processor and ROM/RAM sizes are the same, the EB810v offer the most flexible ports arrangement. 1× 10GE/SFP+ Combo WAN, 1x 10GE LAN and 3× 2.5GE; The HB810 might be more appealing for family/WAF; Archer BE805 beside 1x WAN & 1x LAN as 10Gbps, the other LAN ports are only 1Gbps but 4x.

@limcc

I was just now in Starhub Jurong Point Shop and they have one EB810v.

There are NO FXS ports on the back.

 

[xiaofan]

@Apparatus

Please help to confirm that whether your EB810v has the two FXS ports or not. Thanks.

 

[stephenbishop]

@Apparatus

Please help to confirm that whether your EB810v has the two FXS ports or not. Thanks.

Not @Apparatus but the unit at Plaza Singapura store also did not have the FXS ports and the Starhub agent confirmed to me that the digital voice service bundled with Ultraspeed will be connected to the ONT.

 

[Apparatus]

@Apparatus

Please help to confirm that whether your EB810v has the two FXS ports or not. Thanks.

EB810v do NOT have any FXS port

ONT has 2 telephone ports

Digital Voice will need to connect the phone line to the ONT's FXS port

I spoke to SH tech support on how to use VoIP. Maybe SH needs to activate one LAN port on the ONT to connect to the router's 2.5Gbps port. Maybe this step is not required since there's the WAN line. Then enable VoIP in the router. Have to pay for the phone number lah

If you need to use PoE for the phone then you'll need a switch with PoE port to accomplish that

 

[limcc]

TP-Link has removed the PDF file.


@limcc

I was just now in Starhub Jurong Point Shop and they have one EB810v.

There are NO FXS ports on the back.

yeah, even their YT link--0:19 shown no FXS ports at the back, maybe the PDF was early design? But why add v to the model number if it doesn't support voice?



No issue for the majority of us, most don't use fixedline anymore.

 

[Apparatus]

yeah, even their YT link--0:19 shown no FXS ports at the back, maybe the PDF was early design? But why add v to the model number if it doesn't support voice?



No issue for the majority of us, most don't use fixedline anymore.

The 'v' is for VoIP. EB810v is a VoIP router

Digital Voice don't use the internet whilst VoIP uses the internet

 

[Henry Ng]

I think there will be a "room" or junction box nearby. This is probably why NLT charges higher for the landed residential premise as they need to pull longer Fibre to the premise.
https://www.netlinktrust.com/fibre-network/fibre-network-for-homes

So the split ratio will likely be the same as HDB / Private High Rise Apartments. And I guess it will be 1:32 or 1:64.

The upgrade of the network, can it be referring to 1:64 upgrade to 1:32? Like no news.

 

[xiaofan]

The upgrade of the network, can it be referring to 1:64 upgrade to 1:32? Like no news.

No idea here as I am not an insider -- no relation with the telecom industry.

I tend to think NOT. That is up to the ISPs. For GPON, it is mentioned by some posts that M1 is worse than SingTel/Starhub in this aspect and it tends to have lower average raw speed compared to other ISPs during peak hours. But we should take note raw speed is not really that important for majority of the users, you will not notice the difference unless you are carrying out SpeedTest.

For XGS-PON, then people may soon recognize if the oversubscription ratio is high.

What can the government do?
1) subsidize 10Gbps investment by ISPs
2) subsidize NLT
3) invest in high speed backbones
4) help those who are less well off
5) provide training opportunities and scholarships
6) ...

 

[Henry Ng]

No idea here as I am not an insider -- no relation with the telecom industry.

I tend to think NOT. That is up to the ISPs. For GPON, it is mentioned by some posts that M1 is worse than SingTel/Starhub in this aspect and it tends to have lower average raw speed compared to other ISPs during peak hours. But we should take note raw speed is not really that important for majority of the users, you will not notice the difference unless you are carrying out SpeedTest.

For XGS-PON, then people may soon recognize if the oversubscription ratio is high.

What can the government do?
1) subsidize 10Gbps investment by ISPs
2) subsidize NLT
3) invest in high speed backbones
4) help those who are less well off
5) provide training opportunities and scholarships
6) ...

I just hope that Govt can have some additional under sea internet cable connecting Sg to Malaysia, Thailand, China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Japan and Korea. I just hope so.

 

[keavepoh]

Check the sticker on the router. Likely to be stated there as it's the default. How about the manual?

Is there an option to say you forget your password? If yes just answer yes and input your email. It'll send a new password to the email

Sticker has no password. It's customized specialized by starhub, replied by TP link agents.
Called for onsite support since SH CSO don't understand, called 3 times.